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Max0596
02-18-2012, 08:50 AM
I think not.

And you know why? Because:

1. The games are still fun! If you think of them like I do. Most people(as in the die-hard fans) will tell you that Sonic sucks now, but I think Generations told us something. Modern and Classic are two different entities, and should be considered different. Sure, there isn't much platforming in newer Sonic games, but these are modern games! Maybe Sonic has just evolved into something more than just a platformer, even if those days were amazing all the same. Again, I think Generations did a great job in showcasing both of these "eras" if you will, the speedy, 3D Sonic the newcomers know, and the calmer, 2D platforming Sonic us old players know and love.

2. "All new Sonic games have some stupid gimmick! THEY ALL SUCK!" Is a blatant lie. If people took the game the way they should, as a game, and not a continuation of a series/sequel, they would enjoy the game a lot more. I loved Sonic Unleashed. Yeah, sure, it had it's quirks. I loved the Day stages, and I liked the Night stages too. If people looked at the game as a game instead of what they want it to be, they would love it.

3. People are too hasty. Just because there hasn't been a game that was exactly what they wanted, that definitely does not mean that he hasn't had good games. Okay, so Sonic and the Secret Rings sucked. Okay, so Sonic and the Black Knight was meh and short. They're just experimenting to see what the fans want. I personally want a Sonic Adventure 3, haha! but hey, I'll gladly take another Sonic Colors or Unleashed.

Maybe it's because I can look at my taskbar and see that it's 2:47 AM, but I really just wanted to know what you think. So please, feel free to vote and put your two cents in the form of a quick post in here.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-18-2012, 11:06 AM
I think not.

And you know why? Because:

1. The games are still fun! If you think of them like I do. Most people(as in the die-hard fans) will tell you that Sonic sucks now, but I think Generations told us something. Modern and Classic are two different entities, and should be considered different. Sure, there isn't much platforming in newer Sonic games, but these are modern games! Maybe Sonic has just evolved into something more than just a platformer, even if those days were amazing all the same. Again, I think Generations did a great job in showcasing both of these "eras" if you will, the speedy, 3D Sonic the newcomers know, and the calmer, 2D platforming Sonic us old players know and love.

2. "All new Sonic games have some stupid gimmick! THEY ALL SUCK!" Is a blatant lie. If people took the game the way they should, as a game, and not a continuation of a series/sequel, they would enjoy the game a lot more. I loved Sonic Unleashed. Yeah, sure, it had it's quirks. I loved the Day stages, and I liked the Night stages too. If people looked at the game as a game instead of what they want it to be, they would love it.

3. People are too hasty. Just because there hasn't been a game that was exactly what they wanted, that definitely does not mean that he hasn't had good games. Okay, so Sonic and the Secret Rings sucked. Okay, so Sonic and the Black Knight was meh and short. They're just experimenting to see what the fans want. I personally want a Sonic Adventure 3, haha! but hey, I'll gladly take another Sonic Colors or Unleashed.

Maybe it's because I can look at my taskbar and see that it's 2:47 AM, but I really just wanted to know what you think. So please, feel free to vote and put your two cents in the form of a quick post in here.


You have to keep in mind that these games "suck" to them. It may be a great game to you, but others do not think so. When one makes a statement that Sonic "sucks" as a whole, it is normally fact that the majority rules.

PikaChew
02-19-2012, 12:25 AM
Didnt vote because my choice is only half of one. Are Sonic's best days gone? "Not by a long shot!" (but in my opinion the new games are mostly only average)

I think that Sonic still has many great games to come but in the mean time it is sort of amusing (in a way) to watch him stumble around and get attached to poor decision making in games time and time again. On the bright side though if you think back to early Sonic on the genesis, his health depends on always having at least 1 ring left and so long as he can grab that last ring before each diasaster hits, he can stay alive forever!

Grassy_Aggron
02-19-2012, 06:02 AM
Yes and no.

I love the new games, but...I feel there is something missing. I'm not one of those fans who are unable to be pleased, but...The shortness of the games really kills me, and the somewhat stiff controls.

In short, I long for the Adventure days again...But I enjoy the games as they are.

Sonic Generations was a great game, but I was disappointed by it. Too short, many missed opportunities, and the overall lack of humor that had been in the previous few games...Oh, and the two hour long story game play.

Black Knight was, for some reason, a lot of fun for me to play. Not sure why. I loved the story and the gameplay. So in short, almost every other game I have "liked", not loved like Sonic Adventure 2, Black Knight, and Shadow the Hedgehog (LE GASP! She liked this game?!).


But I have to agree with pe2k Voices. At the same time though, the messed up fanbase which can never be pleased also is strangling to the series to death. SEGA gets credit for trying new formulas, unlike a certain plumber...

Max0596
02-19-2012, 06:23 AM
@Voices: That's why I'm asking you, XD because I want to know if others think the same as me. Sure, I'm probably not right, but that's why there's a poll :3 so you can voice your opinion.

@PikaChew: Yeah, there has been a few bad decisions, but I personally think that it's overall a positive thing. And didn't people think that Adventure wasn't a "true" Sonic game way back then? But then they tried it instead of listening to their friends, and loved the game. I think that if the world wasn't like it is now, where the list of game traits wasn't so messed up, we would have better games.

@Grassy: Yeah, it's a really...odd situation for the blue blur these days. I loved Shadow too XD it was so much fun getting all the endings! But you're right, the controls aren't what they used to be, and none of the new games compare to Adventure/Adventure 2's massive length. There's just something satisfying about finishing a game that took you months and months instead of a few weeks.

BTW, the list of game traits is a little something I made up. A pyramid of what a person looks for in a game, basically.

Back in 2000:
Gameplay
Story
Graphics
BGM/other assorted traits
General Consensus(There wasn't Twitter or Facebook, nor blogs to say whether a game was good or not)

2012:
General Consensus("This game sucks!" written by a famous internet celeb/people googling to see others opinions on a game on IGN may make people not try a game they could love. Also, that total D-bag who says that games suck because he can't play them. Hate that guy >.>)
Graphics(Did you see the new trailer for Skyrim? IT LOOKS SO GREAT!)
Story
Music
Gameplay(Game still looked awesome!)
(Note: sometimes story and gameplay/music are switched.)

Grassy_Aggron
02-19-2012, 06:47 AM
Ha ha, very true. IGN somehow gave Unleashed a WORSE rating that Sonic 2006. Yeah. That game. I haven't even played it and I get furious at it XD


Here's what I look for;

Story
Gameplay
BGM
Graphics


I don't really count a "consensus" to be honest. He he. But graphics are pretty low on my score. Story is the highest (which is where Generations lost a lot of points). Gameplay is important (again, Generations lost some points). BGM (music helps make a game. SEGA never falters here!).

Most games now have good graphics, so I don't really mind.


But this way of thinking probably explains why Quake (1996 PC game) is my favorite game ever, not so much for story but for BGM and gameplay.

bronislav84
02-19-2012, 08:53 AM
How the hell did Unleashed get a worse score than a game that undoes itself? Seriously, the one game I will never play in any way shape or form was 2006. I only read about it. That, and since it effectively didn't happen, I don't consider Blaze/Silver being from the future as canon.

Topic question: No, but we need more games like Generations. There IS a reason why they're making a Sonic 4. Although I won't buy it until they make a compilation. People want more platformer, and games that don't take 2 hours to beat. I personally enjoyed Unleashed and Rings too. Not as much as Adventure/2 and Heroes, which both helped me create my OC, but really they weren't bad. Rings just had a much different control scheme. If they had remade that game as either a platformer or a "modern style" it would have been less of a "suffer through for story" for me. I liked the story, didn't like the gameplay.

What I dislike the most is that ALL games after Sonic 3 + Knuckles have this "achievement" system, artificially bloating the time spent on it. What if I just wanna play the story? Yes, story. I'm a fan of story, and I personally think none of the modern style games have had a poor story.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-19-2012, 01:49 PM
But I have to agree with pe2k Voices. At the same time though, the messed up fanbase which can never be pleased also is strangling to the series to death. SEGA gets credit for trying new formulas, unlike a certain plumber...

You act as though Nintendo exclusively milks their customer's souls. I was under the impression that all companies do that.

Kenny_C.002
02-19-2012, 03:18 PM
The issue of the matter was that Sonic didn't actually transition to 3D nearly as well as Mario did. The design team didn't think over some of the relevant design issues with Sonic's transition, and they have ended suffering for that. That is, the formula of "fast" that Sonic was known for wasn't nearly as apparent in the 3D world as Mario was on jumping on goombas.

The crazy sword and gun stuff was...well crazy.

Max0596
02-19-2012, 06:11 PM
@Grassy: I meant "concensus" as in what everyone views the game as. By the way, that rating proves that IGN is just...not very knowledgeable. I played Sonic '06 once, basically:

-The scripted scenes kill themselves all the time.
-You can stand on a box, sweep kick, and the box goes up. This can be repeated unlimited times to effectively "fly out" of Sonic's Hub stage.
-You can get easily stuck on the snowboard levels, so much so that it becomes frustrating.
-Sonic V Silver. The most retarded boss fight ever.
-It's so rushed and has so many bugs that it's basically unplayable.

Versus Sonic Unleashed:
-Scripted scenes work if you don't screw them up.
-There are no bugs that constantly happen over and over again.
-The day stages were actually quite fun and people said that's why the game was good.
-The night stages that everyone said were bad, weren't in fact bad, just a bit slower and more platform-based than the day stages. And featured combat, like Knuckle's story in Adventure.

@Kenny: Yes, but they actually hit the nail straight on the head with Shadow. The gameplay felt like Adventure/2 and the gus were actually pretty cool IMO. The sword stuff was a bit odd, but it was still fun. Yes, fun. In the mess of all this talk about story and graphics and such, are the games still fun? And really, I think they could have transitioned him better, but I love my Adventure as it is XD

@Bronislav: Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think the companies do one of two things; create a good, solid game where the action is constant and exciting, or prolong the game with achievements or some amazing "final" item.

Princess_Eevee9
02-19-2012, 08:55 PM
How the hell did Unleashed get a worse score than a game that undoes itself? Seriously, the one game I will never play in any way shape or form was 2006. I only read about it. That, and since it effectively didn't happen, I don't consider Blaze/Silver being from the future as canon.

Topic question: No, but we need more games like Generations. There IS a reason why they're making a Sonic 4. Although I won't buy it until they make a compilation. People want more platformer, and games that don't take 2 hours to beat. I personally enjoyed Unleashed and Rings too. Not as much as Adventure/2 and Heroes, which both helped me create my OC, but really they weren't bad. Rings just had a much different control scheme. If they had remade that game as either a platformer or a "modern style" it would have been less of a "suffer through for story" for me. I liked the story, didn't like the gameplay.

What I dislike the most is that ALL games after Sonic 3 + Knuckles have this "achievement" system, artificially bloating the time spent on it. What if I just wanna play the story? Yes, story. I'm a fan of story, and I personally think none of the modern style games have had a poor story.
Blaze is actually from the future if you played Sonic Rush and Rushed Adventure although I don't know about Sliver!!

Although Modern Sonic games of today lack things that the Classic ones had one they do have is character development in my childhood I remember hating playing the original Sonic games if I couldn't play as other characters than Sonic because then it was just basically following a Mario format which bored me at times. I feel with all the diversity that Sonic characters have you think games the non-Adventure games would include them besides just the main ones! Shadow the Hedgehog was my favorite GC Sonic though I stupidly sold the game when I heard what people were saying about it without playing it for myself first!

Negative Zone
02-19-2012, 11:34 PM
Sonic Generations was the best game of 2011 no contest.

Grassy_Aggron
02-20-2012, 05:04 AM
@ Pe2k- Maybe, but SEGA actively listens to what people want. Many of the games - like Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic 2006 (which WAS supposed to reboot the franchise somewhat, I think. ...It nearly killed it instead XD But even that game has merits. Namely the music and Shadow giving Silver a literal boot to the head. HYES.), Sonic 4 were/are developed with what they wanted.

People wanted Sonic with a gun. But SEGA said "That isn't Sonic" and gave it to Shadow. Then people COMPLAINED. Sonic 4 Episode 1 had problems, especially with physics, but for Episode 2 they listened to requests and threw out the old engine. Generations, even, they took advice to finish tweaking it.

I'm not sure about Nintendo, but SEGA tries to please their fanbase. Problem is, they have the worst fanbase ever to please -.-


@ Bronislav - I know, right? Can't spell ignorant without IGN.

Secret Rings was the only game I ever played that I truly hated. I hate Sonic '06, but I haven't actually played it. ...But watching multiple LPs of it makes you realize how much they are suffering while they play it XD I might eventually pick the game up to play it. It's fun to make fun of that.

Yeah, that's true. Many achievements aren't even good now. Although the achievements you can unlock in Generations are a bit amusing to read :3 But I don't know what it gives you for 100%.

@ Max - Plus, in Shadow the Hedgehog, you can hit people with a STOP SIGN. That is awesome. And the Omochao Gun...Too bad he didn't spout pleas for help as he was launched XD And I know that glitch in Sonic '06. I could post a funny video of it from YouTube from someone who is currently doing an LP of it. ...Poor poor soul. He sat through commentating on the game once before, now he's actually playing it and doing it again XD DEDICATION.


@ Kenny - True. It's hard to make a game appear fast without making it really short, though. And I like guns and swords. They were fun to use <3


@ Princess Eevee - No, Blaze is from an alternate dimension, not the future. Either way I don't like Blaze. ...Stealing powers I had for my character long before she appeared...*Grumbling* But yes, I love how people get angry at character development. It's like "Really guys? You want completely flat characters? Go play Call of Duty, then."


@ Negative Zone - As much of a fan I am of Sonic, I don't actually agree with this. Portal 2 was very good (watching LP of it), and I've heard wonderful things about the new Legend of Zelda. I just don't think Generations, as wonderful of a game it is, deserves the #1 spot. Close, but not exactly there.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-20-2012, 11:11 AM
@ Pe2k- Maybe, but SEGA actively listens to what people want. Many of the games - like Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic 2006 (which WAS supposed to reboot the franchise somewhat, I think. ...It nearly killed it instead XD But even that game has merits. Namely the music and Shadow giving Silver a literal boot to the head. HYES.), Sonic 4 were/are developed with what they wanted.

People wanted Sonic with a gun. But SEGA said "That isn't Sonic" and gave it to Shadow. Then people COMPLAINED. Sonic 4 Episode 1 had problems, especially with physics, but for Episode 2 they listened to requests and threw out the old engine. Generations, even, they took advice to finish tweaking it.

I'm not sure about Nintendo, but SEGA tries to please their fanbase. Problem is, they have the worst fanbase ever to please -.-

That is a horrible argument. You said SEGA listens to their fanbase. Their fanbase wanted Sonic with a gun. They did not listen, and you wonder why the fanbase is angry? This is business, Grassy. Very few companies actually care about what they pump out. SEGA doesn't need to care about Sonic anymore because it is already a well-known game. They have a fanbase made of zombies who will buy every game just so they can say, "I bought the new Sonic game." The same thing can be applied to Nintendo, Infinity Ward, Treyarch, Blizzard, and a ton of other game developers.

Kenny_C.002
02-20-2012, 01:54 PM
@Kenny: Yes, but they actually hit the nail straight on the head with Shadow. The gameplay felt like Adventure/2 and the gus were actually pretty cool IMO. The sword stuff was a bit odd, but it was still fun. Yes, fun. In the mess of all this talk about story and graphics and such, are the games still fun? And really, I think they could have transitioned him better, but I love my Adventure as it is XD

@Bronislav: Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think the companies do one of two things; create a good, solid game where the action is constant and exciting, or prolong the game with achievements or some amazing "final" item.

Ya a bunch of the older fans didn't appreciate the guns period and didn't find it fun. I think it is a generational difference that the older sonic fans are having against the younger sonic fans, where there is a difference in what a sonic game should be like, and that is part of the fun they have with sonic.

@ Kenny - True. It's hard to make a game appear fast without making it really short, though. And I like guns and swords. They were fun to use <3

Why not? They managed to do the whole "fast, but not short" thing in the older Sonic games. And honestly, people would rather a short and sweet sonic game than a long and tedious sonic game, if they had to choose. I think the problem is that navigation in 3 dimensions is difficult to combine with speed without it feeling linear. Though additional issues like homing attacks being wonkier in 3D doesn't help either.

bronislav84
02-20-2012, 02:02 PM
Blaze is actually from the future if you played Sonic Rush and Rushed Adventure although I don't know about Sliver!!

Although Modern Sonic games of today lack things that the Classic ones had one they do have is character development in my childhood I remember hating playing the original Sonic games if I couldn't play as other characters than Sonic because then it was just basically following a Mario format which bored me at times. I feel with all the diversity that Sonic characters have you think games the non-Adventure games would include them besides just the main ones! Shadow the Hedgehog was my favorite GC Sonic though I stupidly sold the game when I heard what people were saying about it without playing it for myself first!
No, she isn't. Not in those games. That's what 06 wants you to believe. Sol is a different dimension, not the future. There is a canon disparity between Rush and 06 with Blaze's origin.

Guys, the biggest problem I have with Sonic games nowadays is what they cost for what you get in story. I paid the full $40~ for Generations 3DS and highly regret it. I am only half way through because I do other games and stuff, but I can already see it's incredibly short. Forty dollars for a game I will finish in like a day? No. I bought Colors Wii used a while ago. Heard that one is pretty short too. I beat the story for Unleashed in 3 nights of solid playing. Loved it, but I haven't touched it since then. Paid full price for that too, and also regret it.

Reason I loved Adventure/2 and Heroes was that it took a while to complete and gave me a sense of accomplishment. Riders was great too. I still have yet to get all the Gears in that game, and my Zero Gravity is untouched.

I am very much enjoying my used copy of Rush Adventure like it's predecessor, and will be sad when I end it. The game is NOT short, and I like that. I STILL play the Sonic&Blaze final story in original Rush from time to time. It's just that good. I will never delete my save and restart because some of the Emeralds were a pain in the behind to get, but I really want another Rush game. It somehow manages to do all of modern Sonic's moves, while still doing the classic stuff, and that's why I enjoy it. New + old in one character = good IMO.

Grassy_Aggron
02-21-2012, 03:36 AM
That is a horrible argument. You said SEGA listens to their fanbase. Their fanbase wanted Sonic with a gun. They did not listen, and you wonder why the fanbase is angry? This is business, Grassy. Very few companies actually care about what they pump out. SEGA doesn't need to care about Sonic anymore because it is already a well-known game. They have a fanbase made of zombies who will buy every game just so they can say, "I bought the new Sonic game." The same thing can be applied to Nintendo, Infinity Ward, Treyarch, Blizzard, and a ton of other game developers.

Not really. SEGA actually stuck to what they knew for once - keeping Sonic in character - and they got attacked for it. I honestly think they listen a little more than other companies, judging from what they've done in recent games. But I'm not going to argue the point with you.

And the zombies? They are the dreaded "He doesn't have green eyes RAGENAO" zombies. Seriously. Most pointless argument ever, besides pizza being a vegetable.



I have to agree bronislav. Generations - for 360 - was not worth 56 bucks. I got the free DLC, but...Not worth it. Adventure was so much fun, especially because of Chaos Gardens. (Incidentally, the one thing SEGA isn't listening to fans for XD)

Obliveon
02-21-2012, 06:26 AM
Definately not. I love all the Sonic games, even the ones with sucky graphics. People are always like "The new games aren't worth a crap." I think they are. Sonic Colors was one of the best games I've played. And people really hated Sonic Unleashed, but I don't know why. Sure it was unconventional, and some of the controls were annoying, but I thought it was a beautifully creative game. Everyone seems to hate that there is more than three main characters with individual personalities. Sonic's planet is suppost to be full of people, just like ours, but people seem to act like it should have one character and only one character in it. They also seem to hate the intricate storylines that were put into some of the games. Storylines are part of what makes a game. I love getting part of a storyline and then thinking, 'is that what that means?' or 'I wonder if that's going to happen next.'

Max0596
02-21-2012, 08:58 AM
@Princess Eevee: Yeah, Blaze is from a differet dimension, same goes for the Sol Emeralds, etc etc... I actually liked Rush and it's sequel. It was a lot of fun for me. And by the way, sucked in terms of SATSR was way too harsh. I'm just replaying it, and it's fun XD

@Grassy: Well, yes, Sonic '06 sucked, no doubt, but the thing is, it has bugs. Maybe more than Adventure, but there was some problems with Adventure, and people LOVE it. People nowadays just have higher standards. *sigh* though '06 sucked baaaad...

@Voices: You need to relax, please? SEGA fans are not as bad as some other fans. Square Enix ones, for sure. And by the way, Do I look like a damn zombie? I buy the games to play them, as does everyone else. Implying that most nowadays are stupid jerks may be appropriate, but not an entire fanbase. That's like keeping a class of students in at recess because one kid flipped the teacher off. Just rude.

@Kenny: As long as we're on this topic, I just want to say that AdventureDX is one hell of a long game. 60 missions, and 130 emblems >.>

Another topic to talk about: What happened to Tails? He used to spin dash and fly. Pure awesomeness? Methinks so. But now he's just a worthless background character, and he's kinda...a waste of a character. I could care less about Sonic, really, I want Tails to come back! :D

EDIT: Ninja'- well, not really. I forgot to click the "Post" button XD! SO I'll reply to the new stuff below:

@Bronislav: Yeah, I want a new Rush and Adventure for next christmas. :D

@Grassy: Yeah, but they should be raging about the important thing: Tails ;0;

@Obilveon: Yeah, I agree. What happened to Shadow, Blaze, Silver, Tails, Knuckles and Amy? It seems like they just keep making new characters every game only to never use them again. Like the entire cast of Secret Rings/Black Knight, Chip, Wisps? D: but do not fear, they might be bringing back a few awesome charaters:
http://th09.deviantart.net/fs71/150/i/2011/262/6/4/sonic_generations_easter_egg_1_by_sonicguru-d4achkp.jpg

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-21-2012, 09:08 AM
@Voices: You need to relax, please? SEGA fans are not as bad as some other fans. Square Enix ones, for sure. And by the way, Do I look like a damn zombie? I buy the games to play them, as does everyone else. Implying that most nowadays are stupid jerks may be appropriate, but not an entire fanbase. That's like keeping a class of students in at recess because one kid flipped the teacher off. Just rude.


I am worked up? When did that happen? I can make that generalization because Sonic has a cult fanbase. They would support it no matter what. The people who simply jump on the bandwagon will the be the ones to leave.

Did I say they were jerks? I simply stated that they would eat whatever SEGA fed them, that is what "true" fans do.

That is the way many organizations run their punishment systems. One screws up, the group pays for it.

Max0596
02-21-2012, 09:25 AM
@Voices: Because you're acting worked up. Also, that was me who posted that, not Grassy. Pfft, I would ride on the unsafe, exciting, sometimes dissapointing, fast, and visually amazing bandwagon of Sonic any day over Mario's slow, pathetic, predictable, unchanging, and stable one. Mario will always be the same; but one day Sonic Team will just strike gold and it'll be amazing.

Wewt. That is all.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-21-2012, 03:55 PM
You can by no means say I am acting worked up when reading text.

I find it funny how you not only insult a game that revolutionized the industry that SEGA partakes in, but you make a blatant and ignorant comment about SEGA. I understand you like Sonic, but you have to understand that SEGA is no more amazing than any other game company. They have ups and downs like most other companies and the many styles SEGA takes part in will rarely ever strike gold. It is a dying genre, that goes for Mario as well.

Obliveon
02-21-2012, 05:49 PM
http://th09.deviantart.net/fs71/150/i/2011/262/6/4/sonic_generations_easter_egg_1_by_sonicguru-d4achkp.jpg[/IMG]

Mighty the Armadillo was in the games before? I didn't know that. Cool. :happy:

Grassy_Aggron
02-21-2012, 06:55 PM
Mighty the Armadillo was in the games before? I didn't know that. Cool. :happy:

Mighty was, but only for...Geh...Three games, I believe. Then they forgot about him. Or rather, they can't find a way to put him in - they clearly remember them :/


@ Max: Yeah. Seriously, I miss being able to play as Shadow >.>' He's my favorite. Maybe because actually, you know, does important stuff and doesn't take any crap XD Plus, that motorcycle is awesome. AWESOME. I want it.


@ Pe2k - Well, I willingly admit they're no more amazing. Funny how an argument SEGA listening a little more to their fans than many other companies has devolved into Mario and Sonic dying.

Then again, people have no taste anymore. There is really no story behind Call of Duty, and I fail to see the appeal -.-'

Zappo09
02-22-2012, 12:30 AM
I wonder if there's gonna be a Mario and Sonic Kart Wii.

Max0596
02-22-2012, 12:39 AM
@Voices: What Grassy said.

@Obliveon: Yeah, he was :3 at the very least, it shows that they remember the roots of Sonic.

@Grassy: Yeah, I hope someone already made some sort of copy or something of it XD I mean IRL.

@Zappo: I hope not. That is seriously what Sonic does not need.

And on the IGN thing, here's a....review of Colors:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6i2z761q9PA

So horrible. SO they loved Colors, but it was too...hard? THE OLD GAMES WERE HARD TOO! And that's a minus, and the co-op? It was way too much fun if you were playing with another Sonic fan. The points they bring up are just retarded, especially the music part. The ONLY good thing about '06 was the MUSIC. Lies. Also, Unleashed looks beautiful too! They also say that Colors' took platforming advice from Mario. Yeah, sure, Mario. Basically this reviewer is a shallow idiot who sucks at Sonic and has only played Colors and the old, or as he says, Genesis Golden Age. And guess what game got the same score of 8.5? CoD Black Ops. Their ignorance eludes me.

Oh yeah, one major point? Graphics. ARGH! *flips desk*

I've changed my mind. I hope they bring back all the unused characters and the ones from the comics, and have them PLAYABLE. Not just Sonic anymore, diversity.

Grassy_Aggron
02-23-2012, 04:43 AM
@ Max: *Rolling* Colors? Hard? HARD? AHAHAHAHA XD Seriously, it was way too easy! They want hard? Go talk to Eggmanland in Unleashed! *Augh nightmares...*


Sonic '06 had great music, but it had some gems in there too. Like Shadow more or less giving a roundhouse kick to Silver's head, for instance. That was pure JUSTICE. Creepy villain? Check. Plus it brought the idea of boosting with a very broken gem power up for Sonic. It's control seemed to be like Adventure...I miss those controls. Too stiff now.

It wasn't a great game, but saying only the music was good is...*Shakes head*



Someone I like to watch on YouTube brought up his idea of a Sonic game. Or the characters, at least. They should be fast, but have enough to distinguish them from Sonic. He cited Tails - he could fly and get to new paths. Same with Knuckles. He more or less said leave the shooters and treasure hunting out and make a new IP for those.

...Then again, this is the guy doing Silver's story in '06...Lol. He has a LOT to rant about for that game.

Max0596
02-23-2012, 06:56 AM
@Grassy: Who is this? I would like to watch his videos!

And yeah, maybe it was hard for me in some parts because my nunchuck kept screwing up and I thought it was the game XD and yeah, adventure's controls were awesome because...

They left a lot of room for being quick if you were good enough, or speedrunning. Some people were so fast, that the camera has problems catching up. Also, Sonic was so epic he could jump off the stairs on the Ancient Ruins in Adventure and land on the top. Hell yeah, like a boss.

I hear ya, Eggmanland...*shudders*

I think that they should just go back to Sonic '06, destroy the bugs, add new characters, new missions, and NO GLITCHES, and re-release it. That would be awesome.
...And, of course, fix the plot the F*CKED ITSELF

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-23-2012, 03:05 PM
@ Pe2k - Well, I willingly admit they're no more amazing. Funny how an argument SEGA listening a little more to their fans than many other companies has devolved into Mario and Sonic dying.

Then again, people have no taste anymore. There is really no story behind Call of Duty, and I fail to see the appeal -.-'

I do not consider that the reason it is a dying genre. Consider this. It is predicted that Microsoft will buy Nintendo. Sony is very close to bankruptcy. Japanese game industries are going under. SEGA filed for bankruptcy.

Now let's look at other gaming companies like DICE, Activision, EA, Infinity Ward, Treyarch, Ubisoft, Microsoft, 343 Industries, Bungie, Bioware, Blizzard, Lucas Arts. These companies are doing relatively well.

It is difficult to follow the story of Call of Duty because two series of Call of Duty are run by two different game companies (Infinity Ward and Treyarch). Infinity Ward's acclaimed success, Modern Warfare, has a very deep and disturbing story. Treyfail's Call of Duty's have very little story, and their recent attempt at one failed.

I don't think Sonic is a bad game, but I am just calling it as I see it.

Grassy_Aggron
02-23-2012, 10:27 PM
@ pe2k - SEGA filed for bankruptcy? I don't think they did. I'm sure the website I follow would have reported about it (they catch everything else! I also just checked Wikipedia - which isn't the most accurate sometimes, but they only state financial loss at some point, but nothing about bankruptcy). I highly doubt Microsoft will acquire Nintendo. It just doesn't strike me as a good idea. They could be called a monopoly, because they would be controlling two different game consoles...And if Sony does go out of business (which is possible. They're not doing too well, as you said), then they'll control the market.

I think.


And....I just don't like those games. I feel like they just take examples from real life and turn it into a story. Most do, but it is just the same old "shoot these guys, stop this bomb" type of stuff. It's annoying. Given Mario and Sonic do similar things, but Sonic tries different ways to achieve it. Mario just stays the same, that plumber. (Does he actually do any plumbing?)


Regardless, genres go out and then back in. I doubt Mario or Sonic will ever be truly dead. Both are icons <3


And...I don't feel like arguing this anymore.




@ Max - Lol. It's like the game knew it was so bad, it decided to say "All right, I'm done. Let's pretend this never happened." Kick in the pants though for the people who went through the game, though. "I did all that for WHAT?!" Hur hur.

Lol. BSC broke the camera in Generations at one point XD

BrainScratchComms. (http://www.youtube.com/user/BrainScratchComms) - ...They are funny. Lol.

Johnny! (http://www.youtube.com/user/SGBLikesToPlay) - This guy is also on BSC. He's the one I mentioned. In BSC, he freaks out when Lewis ("Solaris") breaks the Silver fight XD

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-23-2012, 11:11 PM
@ pe2k - SEGA filed for bankruptcy? I don't think they did. I'm sure the website I follow would have reported about it (they catch everything else! I also just checked Wikipedia - which isn't the most accurate sometimes, but they only state financial loss at some point, but nothing about bankruptcy). I highly doubt Microsoft will acquire Nintendo. It just doesn't strike me as a good idea. They could be called a monopoly, because they would be controlling two different game consoles...And if Sony does go out of business (which is possible. They're not doing too well, as you said), then they'll control the market.

I think.


And....I just don't like those games. I feel like they just take examples from real life and turn it into a story. Most do, but it is just the same old "shoot these guys, stop this bomb" type of stuff. It's annoying. Given Mario and Sonic do similar things, but Sonic tries different ways to achieve it. Mario just stays the same, that plumber. (Does he actually do any plumbing?)


Regardless, genres go out and then back in. I doubt Mario or Sonic will ever be truly dead. Both are icons <3


And...I don't feel like arguing this anymore.

Ever wondered why SEGA doesn't make the Dreamcast anymore?

Microsoft could very well purchase Nintendo, and there would be nothing Nintendo could do about it. And depending on how good the Microsoft lobbyists are, they could get away with it too.

I do not care if you do or do not like them. They still have a story, and saying that they don't is a horrible generalization. For instance, Halo has one of the deepest stories ever presented in a video game. Call of Duty can definitely be intense when you are rushing to find a Russian Warlord. Battlefield 3 can play on your heartstrings as you watch Paris, France get blown away by a nuclear explosion. The stories are interesting for some, and boring for others. It is a story nonetheless.

Are you kidding me? Have you played Mario Party, Galaxy, Super Star Saga? The little war that both companies participate in is pointless, because here's a shocker, they are both in the same position. And at least Nintendo can ride on something else other than Mario. You are on a Pokemon forum for Christ's sake.

Point is this. Yes, Sonic's best days are gone. Does that mean they can't be really good? No. They will never be as popular or as innovative as they were because times have moved on (unless they merge or a miracle happens).

Grassy_Aggron
02-23-2012, 11:39 PM
SEGA didn't go bankrupt. They pulled out of the system war because they were losing, and they saved themselves. They knew they couldn't win against the other three, so they switched to game making exclusively. Smart move, as they probably wouldn't be around anymore if they had not.

I never said Halo didn't have a story. I said Modern Warfare and Call of Duty do not. Halo has been...More like an adventure shooter, almost. And aliens XD



I'm not arguing this anymore. Good day.

Max0596
02-24-2012, 08:42 AM
I am done here also, but here's a closing statement:

I'm just going to use TVTropes to sum up all of this.

Those Wacky Nazis (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ThoseWackyNazis) are at it again in World War II (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/WorldWarII) where they're using Soviet Super Science (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SovietSuperScience) to try and destroy the world once again. Good thing the Big Damn Heros (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/BigDamnHeroes) are Just In Time (http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/JustInTime) to save the day. Yippie.

Basically, the whole plot of CoD is just a mess of basic...what's the word...very typical cliche's. Seriously, if you write for the hell of it sometimes, which Grassy and I do, you start to notice "Hey,that's a pretty good plot!" or "Wow, try and not use the same plot device 20 times over in 40 seconds." You might think it's cool that you're always on time in those games, but it's all been done before. There is never, ever, ever any real plot twists or awesome revelations in those games, and there is never a You Are Too Late. Never. Not to be mean, but the stories SUCK. And Halo? Almost as bad. People's tastes are really bad when it comes to plot, obviously. Try TWEWY. That's an amazing plot. Suspense and mystery, instead of CoD's predictable "AHA!" Moments and twists. Halo, same for it. "Oh no, everyone's gonna die. Good thing I can just walk into this building, press a button, and save everyone. Yaaaaaayyyy." Happens in every game. That or it ends with MC saying that he's going to kick ass. Seriously.

The last few sonic games have had a lot of story. Black Knight, which threw in one helluva twist, and Seven Rings, which actually had some decent character development. Do they need better stories? No, they're better than most things out there.

I think SEGA pulling out of consoles was a really smart move. In this day and age, they would've been gone, sadly.

On the topic of Battlefield, same thing as CoD. "Oh noooo everything exploded. Good thing there's a few people left and we can stop them easily! :D" No duh. STILL NOT A GOOD PLOT! If you ask me, they all copied the Tom Clancy books, and 007, and all of that. With PREDICTABLE MOMENTS. They really ruin the game if you know basic cliche's and study the art of writing. If they start doing Aniti-Heroes too, It'll get really, really bad. Also, play on your heartstrings?

How about feeling like you did easily 2 hours of gaming for nothing, just to be thrown back in and have to continue? Then finding out that you've broken the rules too many times, and you're going to be killed by the one person you thought was the strongest in the world, then you pull out of it and win barely, only to realize...you're the bad guy. Yep, you just killed millions and millions of people by beating the main baddie- err...good guy. Then, the real Good Guy, the boss of the other Good Guy, reveals himself, kills you in a second, and decides not to kill the millions of people he was going to (because you won) because you swayed him. Yeah, that's TWEWY in a nutshell. Then you come back to life, finally, after 3 attempts and a lot of game time. You finally live through the 7 days. And after that? You're left with more questions, and so you play through all the story again getting little mission objectives, becoming even stronger, and then you know the real plot. Then you shoot an epically over-powered angel in the face with lasers and all of the other awesome pins you got on your journey. Hell yeah.

It's a story, but an overused, beaten to death, crappy, predictable, annoying, story. So most people with a lick of sense when it comes to good storytelling hate it, and they damnwell should. IT. SUCKS.

No more to debate about.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-24-2012, 02:50 PM
Basically, the whole plot of CoD is just a mess of basic...what's the word...very typical cliche's. Seriously, if you write for the hell of it sometimes, which Grassy and I do, you start to notice "Hey,that's a pretty good plot!" or "Wow, try and not use the same plot device 20 times over in 40 seconds." You might think it's cool that you're always on time in those games, but it's all been done before. There is never, ever, ever any real plot twists or awesome revelations in those games, and there is never a You Are Too Late. Never. Not to be mean, but the stories SUCK. And Halo? Almost as bad. People's tastes are really bad when it comes to plot, obviously. Try TWEWY. That's an amazing plot. Suspense and mystery, instead of CoD's predictable "AHA!" Moments and twists. Halo, same for it. "Oh no, everyone's gonna die. Good thing I can just walk into this building, press a button, and save everyone. Yaaaaaayyyy." Happens in every game. That or it ends with MC saying that he's going to kick ass. Seriously.

You have never played any of these games.

The last few sonic games have had a lot of story. Black Knight, which threw in one helluva twist, and Seven Rings, which actually had some decent character development. Do they need better stories? No, they're better than most things out there.

I think SEGA pulling out of consoles was a really smart move. In this day and age, they would've been gone, sadly.

So you admit that their glory days are gone.

On the topic of Battlefield, same thing as CoD. "Oh noooo everything exploded. Good thing there's a few people left and we can stop them easily! :D" No duh. STILL NOT A GOOD PLOT! If you ask me, they all copied the Tom Clancy books, and 007, and all of that. With PREDICTABLE MOMENTS. They really ruin the game if you know basic cliche's and study the art of writing. If they start doing Aniti-Heroes too, It'll get really, really bad. Also, play on your heartstrings?

You would never like any modern fictional political/war novel then.

It's a story, but an overused, beaten to death, crappy, predictable, annoying, story. So most people with a lick of sense when it comes to good storytelling hate it, and they damnwell should. IT. SUCKS.

So you could have predicted the events of Modern Warfare 3 by playing Call of Duty 4? You could have predicted the destruction of Paris by simply fighting in Iran? As I have said, you have either never played these games (or bothered to follow them), or you are trolling.

No more to debate about.

That is your opinion.

SEGA didn't go bankrupt. They pulled out of the system war because they were losing, and they saved themselves. They knew they couldn't win against the other three, so they switched to game making exclusively. Smart move, as they probably wouldn't be around anymore if they had not.

SEGA went bankrupt because of the millions they pored into advertising and the pathetic amount of Dreamcasts actually sold in the U.S

I never said Halo didn't have a story. I said Modern Warfare and Call of Duty do not. Halo has been...More like an adventure shooter, almost. And aliens XD

Treyarch Call of Duty, I can agree with you. Modern Warfare, I cannot.



I'm not arguing this anymore. Good day.

Okay. You too.


Now if you excuse me, I am going to go play Mario and Sonic and enjoy them while they last.

Grassy_Aggron
02-24-2012, 11:47 PM
There is no evidence to support they went bankrupt -.- I've looked it up. The one article I bothered to look at didn't even have a source.


Max didn't admit their glory days were gone, he said they were smart to pull out of the race. Please don't shove words into his mouth. And there is a difference between analyzing something and trolling, deary.



But you're right. I'm done talking about it. Because I'm PO'ed now, with all this pointless arguing. I always break into an argument with you, and I don't feel like spending more energy on you than I already have.







Basic - I don't think they're gone. Everyone hits a rough patch <3 And more or less, the bad ratings are undeserved. Can't spell ignorant without IGN. And the fans that cannot be pleased keep pushing, pushing, pushing. SEGA needs to give Sonic a rest for a year or so. Work on, say, Billy Hatcher or a new Crazy Taxi. Or Ecco the Dolphin! (Bloody game was so hard...)

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-25-2012, 12:17 AM
There is no evidence to support they went bankrupt -.- I've looked it up. The one article I bothered to look at didn't even have a source.


Max didn't admit their glory days were gone, he said they were smart to pull out of the race. Please don't shove words into his mouth. And there is a difference between analyzing something and trolling, deary.



But you're right. I'm done talking about it. Because I'm PO'ed now, with all this pointless arguing. I always break into an argument with you, and I don't feel like spending more energy on you than I already have.



Basic - I don't think they're gone. Everyone hits a rough patch <3 And more or less, the bad ratings are undeserved. Can't spell ignorant without IGN. And the fans that cannot be pleased keep pushing, pushing, pushing. SEGA needs to give Sonic a rest for a year or so. Work on, say, Billy Hatcher or a new Crazy Taxi. Or Ecco the Dolphin! (Bloody game was so hard...)

You think I am trolling? xD Why are you PO'ed? How is this pointless? It cannot be an analysis when they have no idea what they are talking about.

They did not cancel the Dreamcast because they were smart, they canceled it because of their poor marketing.

I do not give a damn about IGN, Gamestop, GT, or any other game reviewers. I play the game and judge for myself. SEGA isn't gone, but their glory days are. A company can still be good and not be as successful as they were. As I said, the only way they will get back is if they merge with another company or they build a new gaming engine (and it had better be damn good) that no one else has.

Grassy_Aggron
02-25-2012, 12:22 AM
You think I am trolling? xD Why are you PO'ed? How is this pointless?

I never said you were. I'm not discussing this anymore. Good day.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-25-2012, 12:26 AM
Alright then.

Max0596
02-26-2012, 06:49 AM
I've played every Halo, CoD, and read a LOT of that genre. I was SAYING(Protip: READ POSTS THOUROUGHLY) that they copied many of these great books I grew up with, like Tom Clancy. Seriously, READ. I'm not afraid to admit that you're getting on my nerves now. Also, I judge games when I PLAY them. I just played Skyrim. I like it. Before that, all I said was "Haven't played it yet, so I don't know."

Seriously, this has turned from a debate thread to you pointlessly flaming others because you think you know everything, and because you can't bother to do anything but obviously read a few words that I write, instead of the whole thing. So here, I'll bold it for you. Because all of what I write is important if you're going to respond. Also, I DAMNWELL did predict the plot twists, because THAT'S WHAT I DAMNWELL SAID. Predictable moments back in the old 007 and the old Tom Clancy books were PRICELESS, because they were something way different back then. Like thinking "You know what, I think this'll happen next..." and reading on to find out that you were right. It was great. CoD and Battlefield are SHOVING these ideals that were once great down our throats.

READ: I am NOT trolling. However, I am quite mad, bro.

Bottom line, NO, they aren't gone. Time works magic, and everything will get better.

@Grassy: Yeah, I hope they make a new Billy Hatcher. I wanted Sonic Adventure 2 Battle so bad for my Gamecube, but it was sold out, and I picked up the game at EB. I looked at it, bought it, and loved it. A LOT. XD Then got SA2B and loved it too :D


And Please lock this topic, whatever moderator is reading. It'll just lead to more of me raging if it stays open.

NO MORE REPLIES, TOPIC SHOULD BE CLOSED.

Teddiursa of the Sky
02-26-2012, 07:50 AM
Now who is the one who has lost their temper? I will no longer debate since you have obviously lost your cool.

Max0596
02-26-2012, 11:47 AM
Wha...what? I mean...what are you...what? *explodes*

Ataro
02-26-2012, 03:12 PM
*Thread locked according to thread creator's request.