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PokéJungle
09-17-2006, 03:57 PM
[Title is a play-on from Tyranitar_Trainer's thread.]

What do you guys think about Muslims being violent now because of the Pope's comments?

I think they need to grow up. DEBATE, DON'T HATE!

Ham and Cheese
09-17-2006, 04:02 PM
It's natural for people to get defensive if someone comments sourly on their religion...

I don't know the entire story...

But srsly, the Christians are honestly no better. Telling them to grow up is kind of immature. ;/

GaryEX
09-17-2006, 04:26 PM
[Title is a play-on from Tyranitar_Trainer's thread.]

What do you guys think about Muslims being violent now because of the Pope's comments?

I think they need to grow up. DEBATE, DON'T HATE!
Hmm, nice I like that...

Seven
09-17-2006, 04:59 PM
Obviously there is no such thing as "the muslims". It does seem however that whenever there is religious controversy, there are certain muslim groups that feel the need to openly protest - in some cases break things and what not. I dunno what to think of that, it's a different culture, obviously a more emotional one than our own and I hold no judgment over it. All I can say is that from < my > perspective, it's a childish, foolish and dumb.
Although I absolutely do NOT support the pope, but his words were taken out of context...if you'd hear the sentences he said before the infamous quote, then you see why it wasn't intended hurtful.
Still, it IS kinda weird to use such a quote, certainly from a "leader" of a "country" that is responsible for some of the most awful things in human history. So basically, pope, STFU as you should about everything, go get a real job that doesn't include hating, lying and oppressing in the name of love - and certain kinds of muslims, STFU, and don't get offended every. freaking. time.

There.

PokéJungle
09-18-2006, 02:16 AM
Certain Muslim groups made death threats to the American population AND burned our flag, but did we ***** about it and start pulverizing their places of worship? No.

Seriously, my "grow up" comment was not out of line. The whole Middle East is like an effing group of kids who don't know how to deal with each other socially.

Ham and Cheese
09-18-2006, 02:18 AM
But you have to remember that many of the countries in the Middle East are undeveloped. They don't know any better. Many of them barely know how to read.

Don't you believe you're being a little biased? I mean, saying that the entire Middle East is like a group of kids is just...

-_-

My father is Muslim, so I guess it's natural for me to be a little upset.

Alakazam
09-18-2006, 02:41 AM
[Title is a play-on from Tyranitar_Trainer's thread.]

What do you guys think about Muslims being violent now because of the Pope's comments?

I think they need to grow up. DEBATE, DON'T HATE!

Despite the fact that the Pope's comment was taken completely out of text, Muslims have every right to be angered about it and to protest. However, with that being said, the violence that some of these people are showing is completely irresponsible, unwarranted, and it just should not be happening (just like the outragous violence that ensued after the Dutch cartoon depicting the Prophet Muhammud a little while back). So, in that respect, I agree with you when you say "I think they need to grow up."


But srsly, the Christians are honestly no better. Telling them to grow up is kind of immature. ;/

The Christians are no better? Oh, come on - are you serious? What have Christians done recently (say, the past 20 years) that qualifies being "no better than" the violent protest and death threats these Muslims have shown?

Now I'm not saying that the violent ones represent the majority of Arab Muslims, because I really don't know, but what I do know is that these people should be ashamed of theirselves. To believe that one's religion represents the only truth in this world, and that any non-believers may as well be dead...it reminds me of the despicible ideology of the Christian fundamentalists, and it MAKES ME SICK.

We Taste Pies...
09-18-2006, 02:43 AM
Certain Muslim groups made death threats to the American population AND burned our flag, but did we ***** about it and start pulverizing their places of worship? No.

Seriously, my "grow up" comment was not out of line. The whole Middle East is like an effing group of kids who don't know how to deal with each other socially.

Humans are as humans do. Humans do what they want, when they want. It's human nature. Anger and revenge are natural to humans.

Would you be angry if a religous leader of another religion said something offensive about your religion? Look at it from both sides. Religion is part of culture. Culture is an erxtremely important part of life. What the pope did was basically, verbally attacking the middle eastern culture. Wouldn't that make you angry as well? Chew on those words pokejungle:tongue:

Alakazam
09-18-2006, 02:46 AM
Humans are as humans do. Humans do what they want, when they want. It's human nature. Anger and revenge are natural to humans.

Would you be angry if a religous leader of another religion said something offensive about your religion? Look at it from both sides. Religion is part of culture. Culture is an erxtremely important part of life. What the pope did was basically, verbally attacking the middle eastern culture. Wouldn't that make you angry as well? Chew on those words pokejungle:tongue:

No. Just as being wronged does not justify terrorists slaughtering innocent people, issuing death threats is not at all acceptable or mature behavior in response to an insult, even if it is religious in nature.

Matt
09-18-2006, 02:53 AM
Another reason that organized religion is stupid in general. Nothing but "we're right, you're wrong."

We Taste Pies...
09-18-2006, 02:56 AM
Another reason that organized religion is stupid in general. Nothing but "we're right, you're wrong."

Thats probably the best post yet...

Surly Professor
09-18-2006, 03:15 AM
I actually haven't heard the quote in question, but I think I got the gist of it from the news, and I thought it was rather fun that they react violently to being called "violent".

" "Violent", we'll show ya "violent"! "
"Rabble, rabble, rabble"

Seven
09-18-2006, 11:34 AM
Despite the fact that the Pope's comment was taken completely out of text, Muslims have every right to be angered about it and to protest. However, with that being said, the violence that some of these people are showing is completely irresponsible, unwarranted, and it just should not be happening (just like the outragous violence that ensued after the Dutch cartoon depicting the Prophet Muhammud a little while back). So, in that respect, I agree with you when you say "I think they need to grow up."


It was a Danish paper, and they were Danish cartoons :P.

PokéJungle
09-18-2006, 11:35 AM
WtP: Yes, I would. I'm Christian, and I'd be highly offended if a prominent Muslim criticised my religion.

BUT the real question is what would I do about it? Would I deface a Muslim place of worship, or knock a few of them for a loop to get out my anger? No, I can honestly say I wouldn't.

The best thing to do is to gather with peaceful protests and change the world through numbers and ideas, as Martin Luther King Jr has proven. He was truly a hero. Cooler than Malcolm X.

Neo Emolga
09-18-2006, 06:38 PM
One of the big problems is, the whole Islamic religion is being associated with terrorism. Many people automatically think of terrorism when the word “Islam” is mentioned. Instead of being associated with the good things that have come out of the religion, people instead think of the bombing of the World Trade Center and the Pentagon, as well as the bombings in Spain and England. Terrorism is no longer considered a “radical act,” but instead a “religious practice.”

In my strongest opinion, killing or hurting someone just because they don’t believe the same things as you do and choose not to do it is undoubtedly one of the most inhumane, ignorant, and most ludicrous excuse of all time. If anything, these radical believers of Islam are actually doing a disservice to the entire Islamic faith, making their religion even less appealing to practice. If Islam is becoming so associated with terrorism, who the heck would even want to associate or practice it? Who would want to practice a religion where the believers maim and murder anyone who doesn’t believe what they believe, and then blow themselves to bits thinking they’ll actually be rewarded for it?

One of the best remarks I have ever read was this one:

Muslims fly commercial airliners into buildings in New York City. No Muslim outrage.
Muslim officials block the exit where school girls are trying to escape a burning building because their faces were exposed. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims cut off the heads of three teenaged girls on their way to school in Indonesia. A Christian school. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder teachers trying to teach Muslim children in Iraq. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder over 80 tourists with car bombs outside cafes and hotels in Egypt. No Muslim outrage.
A Muslim attacks a missionary children's school in India. Kills six. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims slaughter hundreds of children and teachers in Beslan, Russia. Muslims shoot children in the back. No Muslim outrage.
Let's go way back. Muslims kidnap and kill athletes at the Munich Summer Olympics. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims fire rocket-propelled grenades into schools full of children in Israel. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder more than 50 commuters in attacks on London subways and busses. Over 700 are injured. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims massacre dozens of innocents at a Passover Seder. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims murder innocent vacationers in Bali. No Muslim outrage.
Muslim newspapers publish anti-Semitic cartoons. No Muslim outrage
Muslims are involved, on one side or the other, in almost every one of the 125+ shooting wars around the world. No Muslim outrage.
Muslims beat the charred bodies of Western civilians with their shoes, then hang them from a bridge. No Muslim outrage.
Newspapers in Denmark and Norway publish cartoons depicting Mohammed. Muslims are outraged.

"Dead children. Dead tourists. Dead teachers. Dead doctors and nurses. Death, destruction and mayhem around the world at the hands of Muslims .. no Muslim outrage ... but publish a cartoon depicting Mohammed with a bomb in his turban and all hell breaks loose."

Way to go Islam, for making your religion even less appealing to practice, and for making the good-hearted and honest worshipers of your religion embarrassed and ashamed. You’ve done exactly opposite of what you were trying to accomplish. But, I for one, definitely don’t believe that every Islamic worshiper is evil and/or is a terrorist. But trust me, if anyone is going to get through to the radicals of their religion, it’s them.

I think it’s time they start thinking of compassion, empathy, and consideration for fellow humans before they wire their next explosives or plan on hijacking another plane. They wouldn’t want us bombing them in the name of religion as much as we don’t want them to do the same to us. That's what they need to start getting through their heads.

Terrorism will never get anyone intelligent to convert. Society relies off of cooperation, service, and compassion. If they can't get that through their heads, then it's their own future that they'll be sending up in flames.

Alakazam
09-18-2006, 06:58 PM
You're absolutely right, Neo. It's pretty fair to say its their own fault that their religion is closely associated with terrorism among non-believers.

Ham and Cheese
09-18-2006, 08:52 PM
Yes, but what about the people who are Islamic, yet are not associated whatsoever with terrorist? They're the ones that have to pay the price for their own kind's stupidity.

People in America are starting to look at Islamic people as a threat, even though they've done NOTHING wrong.

I'm in no way defending what those Muslim people did, it's horrifying but the good Muslims are also thrown in the bin too. :\

Alakazam
09-18-2006, 10:17 PM
Yes, but what about the people who are Islamic, yet are not associated whatsoever with terrorist? They're the ones that have to pay the price for their own kind's stupidity.

People in America are starting to look at Islamic people as a threat, even though they've done NOTHING wrong.

I'm in no way defending what those Muslim people did, it's horrifying but the good Muslims are also thrown in the bin too. :\

Well, it depends - I think there are 2 distinct groups of Muslims who have nothing to do with terrorism, and for the sake of simplicity we'll call them A and B. The reason for this is because I really think its the culture prevalent in the Middle East that's encouraging this hatred.

Group A is made up of Muslims who live in the Middle East.

Group B is made up of Muslims who live in NON-Muslim countres (such as North America, Europe).

When I said before that "it's their own fault", I had Group A in mind. Because really, even if they're not actually assisting terrorists, they certainly condone their actions, and don't dare to speak out against it, and that's why I think they deserve the reputation they've earned.

On the other hand, Group B, being removed from the middle east I don't think deserve to be characterized like group A, and it is very sad to see people discriminate against them.

chanseypanty
09-18-2006, 10:33 PM
Well, it depends - I think there are 2 distinct groups of Muslims who have nothing to do with terrorism, and for the sake of simplicity we'll call them A and B. The reason for this is because I really think its the culture prevalent in the Middle East that's encouraging this hatred.

Group A is made up of Muslims who live in the Middle East.

Group B is made up of Muslims who live in NON-Muslim countres (such as North America, Europe).

When I said before that "it's their own fault", I had Group A in mind. Because really, even if they're not actually assisting terrorists, they certainly condone their actions, and don't dare to speak out against it, and that's why I think they deserve the reputation they've earned.

On the other hand, Group B, being removed from the middle east I don't think deserve to be characterized like group A, and it is very sad to see people discriminate against them.
I don't get why they keep messing with their religions, keeping them the same keep it safe and god if they change it, god will punish.
That's why we're safe, I'm buddhist and we're peaceful.

Yes, I could kill my best friend.

TVTMaster
09-18-2006, 10:37 PM
Obviously the terrorism is much more under control here, and though Islam is not violent at the moment in the US, it would well be so if the US were not as powerful, say, with the limited power and resources of a third world country. It's the weak Middle Eastern government that is really allowing the terrorism to spread. Since the Middle East was very recently a theocracy, and still is in some places, any terrorism in the name of Allah was encouraged.

In response to Alakazam's comment on people believing their religion was the only truth... if that was in reference to Christianity at all, it's quite obviously not the only truth. The Bible is a set of guidelines explaining Christianity and the Christian worldview. Scientific discoveries are not always put down by the Ible. It doesn't say gravity doesn't exist, and even evolution is acceptable in broad Christian terms. Mostly because of vagueness in Genesis where there's confusion over whether the seven days of creation were literal days or periods in the scientific timeline, and so perhaps evolution was a part of how God created the world. Really depends on interpretation. Most Christians don't believe the Bible is flawed, but different Christian philosophies hold different views, the extremists being the ones who take most everything literally, and due to their outspoken nature have made the stereotype. I'm the type who believes what the Bible says, but doesn't try to use it do disprove science and that stuff. While I'd hold the word of God over science anyday, it only rarely conflicts with science.

... Dang, I got way off-topic there. I'm probably going to quote single post whenever some science-crazed-chistian-hating atheist tries to put me down.

Seawolf
09-18-2006, 11:10 PM
Personally, I think it's ridiculous for them to react that way to just one little thing. People are so touchy.

If you don't like it, ignore it. It's as simple as that. Neo's post pretty much says it all.

.AzureLight
09-18-2006, 11:50 PM
No offence, but 60% of muslims are total jerks. They ******* think they own this world and that they are all godly and ****. Do you see Christians commiting acts of terrorism when Jesus is portrayed in a cartoon? Hell no.

Alakazam
09-18-2006, 11:55 PM
In response to Alakazam's comment on people believing their religion was the only truth... if that was in reference to Christianity at all, it's quite obviously not the only truth.

No, it had nothing to do with Christianity.

Ham and Cheese
09-19-2006, 12:09 AM
@ Lan:

*takes deep breath*

*tries to keep cool*

And have you met 60% of the 1,300,000,000 Muslims in the world (this is an approximate figure)?

Christians can be jerks too. Everybody acts like the Christians are all dandy and wonderful and toss the Muslims off as terroristic.

Okay, so maybe the Christians didn't flip out over cartoons depicting Jesus--does that make them 'ZOMFG, THE CHRISTIANS ARE SOOOO MUCH BETTER?' Dammit, some groups of Christianity are stuck-up and think they're godly too.

Do you get my point?

That comment was about as stereotypical as you can get, you have no evidence to support that and I highly doubt you've met 60% of the Muslims. :\

Dakota
09-19-2006, 01:25 AM
Uhh...this thread is getting kind of touchy.

But I sincerely believe that all the fighting in the middle east is an economic and culture issue, not a religious issue. The reason that is because that the muslim religion that is being taught over there is literally the same muslim religion being taught here. But over in the middle east, they add the traditions and the jihads and the killings. It's not because of muslim beliefs, it's because of government beliefs.

I don't know what the pope said either, but I'm not in support of the pope. I don't know if he's a christian or not, but I do know that he's catholic, and I don't like catholocism. Oh, here's an interesting tidbit for you:

Al Capone killed 3000 people just to make money
Hitler killed 6 million jews because he believed in racial superiority
Tojo killed 21 million of his own people just to instill fear
The catholic church has killed over 150 million because people would not follow their religion.


meh

chanseypanty
09-19-2006, 01:28 AM
Uhh...this thread is getting kind of touchy.

But I sincerely believe that all the fighting in the middle east is an economic and culture issue, not a religious issue. The reason that is because that the muslim religion that is being taught over there is literally the same muslim religion being taught here. But over in the middle east, they add the traditions and the jihads and the killings. It's not because of muslim beliefs, it's because of government beliefs.

I don't know what the pope said either, but I'm not in support of the pope. I don't know if he's a christian or not, but I do know that he's catholic, and I don't like catholocism. Oh, here's an interesting tidbit for you:

Al Capone killed 3000 people just to make money
Hitler killed 6 million jews because he believed in racial superiority
Tojo killed 21 million of his own people just to instill fear
The catholic church has killed over 150 million because people would not follow their religion.


meh
Why can't they just live in harmony so there's no trouble and it's safe.

I don't know why they are so stupid, they fight for nothing and end up dying.And then go to hell.

PokéJungle
09-19-2006, 03:21 AM
@ Lan:

*takes deep breath*

*tries to keep cool*

And have you met 60% of the 1,300,000,000 Muslims in the world (this is an approximate figure)?

Christians can be jerks too. Everybody acts like the Christians are all dandy and wonderful and toss the Muslims off as terroristic.

Okay, so maybe the Christians didn't flip out over cartoons depicting Jesus--does that make them 'ZOMFG, THE CHRISTIANS ARE SOOOO MUCH BETTER?' Dammit, some groups of Christianity are stuck-up and think they're godly too.

Do you get my point?

That comment was about as stereotypical as you can get, you have no evidence to support that and I highly doubt you've met 60% of the Muslims. :\
Basically your comment was stereotypical too. People have had a lot of backlash at any and all religious groups, in particular Christians. You'll look at any debate about Christianity involving non-Christian people and the latter group will be berating Christians for something or other, holding them up to the "perfect" standard.

And you really don't need to feel bad about the "innocent" Muslims getting grouped with the terrorists either. The ones who aren't speaking out against the extremists of their religion are only helping them.

Just like you can't really condone Germans that didn't help the Jews in WWII, even though they may not have "liked" what Hitler was doing.

Ham and Cheese
09-19-2006, 08:33 PM
Dude, what if they opt not to say anything at all? :| That doesn't mean they're condoning it, it's just that they don't feel comfortable saying anything.

spartan117
09-20-2006, 12:19 AM
It's natural for people to get defensive if someone comments sourly on their religion...

I don't know the entire story...

But srsly, the Christians are honestly no better. Telling them to grow up is kind of immature. ;/
What you smokin man?

Ham and Cheese
09-20-2006, 12:20 AM
What the hell?

That comment was unnecessary and my comment was fine. :/

Seawolf
09-20-2006, 12:33 AM
What the hell?

That comment was unnecessary and my comment was fine. :/

Don't feed the troll. :wink:

Now you all know why I'm not religious. It ruins people.

chanseypanty
09-20-2006, 12:35 AM
Don't feed the troll. :wink:

Now you all know why I'm not religious. It ruins people.
But your families are, right:eh:

Ham and Cheese
09-20-2006, 12:36 AM
I'm not religious either, I know that something out there exists but I think that religion is just another excuse for everything bad that happens in life.

PokéJungle
09-20-2006, 11:20 AM
Don't feed the troll. :wink:

Now you all know why I'm not religious. It ruins people.
Ok, that was rather hateful. Shame on you.

Alakazam
09-20-2006, 11:42 AM
Dude, what if they opt not to say anything at all? :| That doesn't mean they're condoning it, it's just that they don't feel comfortable saying anything.

That's why I say this is a serious cultural issue - am I the only one that sees that not feeling comfortable about speaking out against terrorism is icredibly backwards and messed up?

PokéJungle
09-20-2006, 02:06 PM
That's why I say this is a serious cultural issue - am I the only one that sees that not feeling comfortable about speaking out against terrorism is icredibly backwards and messed up?
You're definitely not the only one dude.

Vampire
09-20-2006, 02:10 PM
:susp: They moan we are being racist and look what thee doing

PokéJungle
09-20-2006, 02:16 PM
:susp: They moan we are being racist and look what thee doing
That's usually how it works.

People really shouldn't make such a big deal about differences. Srsly.

Neo Emolga
09-20-2006, 02:30 PM
:susp: They moan we are being racist and look what thee doing

Actually, Muslim terrorists are quite possibly the worst kinds of racists. Simply, bombing and killing people of another religion is no different than what the Nazis did to the Jews, along with many other people. It's this whole idiotic fantasy that makes them think their race/religion/government is superior to anything else, so everything else should be eliminated.

Believe it or not, most Al Qaeda members are actually students being force fed propaganda, very similar to what new members of the Nazis were fed during their younger years. An Arabic or other Middle Eastern child isn't born into the world with hate and the desire to exterminate all other religions except their own, they are taught it by someone else. Hence, this is the reason why it's wrong to hate all people of Islamic faith. The ones that need to be targeted are the leaders teaching members of Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups this information, they're the ones that are trying to gain power, and using their religion as an excuse for doing so. Meanwhile, devout members of the Islamic faith are believing them on behalf of their religion, thinking this is what their religion is really all about. But its not, just look at the peaceful members of the Islamic faith that don't get involved with terrorism.

It's the peaceful members of the Islamic faith that need to be the role models here, not the terrorist ones.

PokéJungle
09-20-2006, 02:34 PM
Actually, Muslim terrorists are quite possibly the worst kinds of racists. Simply, bombing and killing people of another religion is no different than what the Nazis did to the Jews, along with many other people. It's this whole idiotic fantasy that makes them think their race/religion/government is superior to anything else, so everything else should be eliminated.

Believe it or not, most Al Qaeda members are actually students being force fed propaganda, very similar to what new members of the Nazis were fed during their younger years. An Arabic or other Middle Eastern child isn't born into the world with hate and the desire to exterminate all other religions except their own, they are taught it by someone else. Hence, this is the reason why it's wrong to hate all people of Islamic faith. The ones that need to be targeted are the leaders teaching members of Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups this information, they're the ones that are trying to gain power, and using their religion as an excuse for doing so. Meanwhile, devout members of the Islamic faith are believing them on behalf of their religion, thinking this is what their religion is really all about. But its not, just look at the peaceful members of the Islamic faith that don't get involved with terrorism.

It's the peaceful members of the Islamic faith that need to be the role models here, not the terrorist ones.
Yep, Arab Nazis basically.

Sad sad situation. Lucky we have Bush, START A WAR!

Neo Emolga
09-20-2006, 02:44 PM
Yep, Arab Nazis basically.

Sad sad situation. Lucky we have Bush, START A WAR!

Right now, the war we have going on there really isn't helping the situation at all...

If we really wanted to win the war against terrorism, it would be through motivating peaceful Islamic believers to start movements to get terrorists to stop seeing violence as a solution. A campaign to get terrorists to looks more toward the peaceful teachings of the Qu'ran instead of bombs or firearms would be far more successful than showing up with our own troops and entraping them into a position to defend themselves. Peace is not a byproduct of war, only exhaustion is, which eventually turns into reconstruction and then peace.

However, peace can be a byproduct of proper teaching and practice. That's what needs to be done here...

PokéJungle
09-20-2006, 02:47 PM
Right now, the war we have going on there really isn't helping the situation at all...

If we really wanted to win the war against terrorism, it would be through motivating peaceful Islamic believers to start movements to get terrorists to stop seeing violence as a solution. A campaign to get terrorists to looks more toward the peaceful teachings of the Qu'ran instead of bombs or firearms would be far more successful than showing up with our own troops and entraping them into a position to defend themselves. Peace is not a byproduct of war, only exhaustion is, which eventually turns into reconstruction and then peace.

However, peace can be a byproduct of proper teaching and practice. That's what needs to be done here...
You completely missed the in-your-face sarcasm of my post.

Bush started a useless war. Osama Bin-Laden is on the run. Al-Queda is still at large.

What effing 'War on Terror' is he talking about? It's just an excuse to take OUR freedoms here at home. [Well, I say that as if I were in the US right now].

Neo Emolga
09-20-2006, 03:00 PM
You completely missed the in-your-face sarcasm of my post.

Bush started a useless war. Osama Bin-Laden is on the run. Al-Queda is still at large.

What effing 'War on Terror' is he talking about? It's just an excuse to take OUR freedoms here at home. [Well, I say that as if I were in the US right now].

Okay, I had a strong feeling you were being sarcastic, but you never know. I've seen some people blindly praise everything Bush has been doing to the point of being disgusting.

Right now, trying to impose our beliefs on what we think is a working government is such a bad idea, especially considering we're dealing with a country and culture that is very different to ours. And like you said, this isn't a war on terror any more, this is more about trying to impose ideals on the nation of Iraq, and that's exactly what they don't want. Heck, imagine for a moment that its us that just had to get Bush removed from office, and now it's some other country trying to think we're the ones that need fixing and that we should have all of our government handling completely turned over to another polictal system. Heck, I can tell you right now, most American people would go nuts with that. Well, that's the same thing here.

Our focus should be on removing terrorist leaders, not getting our noses into this kind of nonsense. I think things like giving the people of Iraq freedom is excellent, and seeing them being able to participate in things like the Olympics is great and all, but they need to be the ones to decide how they want their government and country to be run, not us.

Nykwana Wombosi
09-22-2006, 06:32 PM
[Title is a play-on from Tyranitar_Trainer's thread.]

What do you guys think about Muslims being violent now because of the Pope's comments?

I think they need to grow up. DEBATE, DON'T HATE!
I think you need to grow up.

What you smokin man?
Lol. *High fives*

Anyway, radicals' reaction of threatening with violence in reply to the pope's comments is sheer stupidity, since it only sharpens the pope's suggestion that there is a relation between the islam and violence.

PokéJungle
09-23-2006, 02:57 AM
I think you need to grow up.


Lol. *High fives*

Anyway, radicals' reaction of threatening with violence in reply to the pope's comments is sheer stupidity, since it only sharpens the pope's suggestion that there is a relation between the islam and violence.
I think you need to grow up. So nyah.

Sudo
09-24-2006, 11:35 AM
Here's a story that doesn't answer the question but...

I grew up in a place called Bradford, a very multicultural area. It was great, I had mates from just about every continent in the world. We'd hang out and embrace eachothers differences, we were very young and thats what childeren tend to do if they are shielded from their parents prejudices. There were not many Muslims there because they tend not to mix with other cultures (in that area) for some reason. We saw them occasionally, but they were racist to me and all my friends so we disliked them.

Anyway, one day, a Muslim family moved in, and we introduced ourselves to them. They ignored us for a while but we continued to try to get to know their kids. So a week later their cousins move in next door to them, and we were happy, this meant the chance of more friends. Little did we know that 5 years later we would return to see the whole area inhabited them. The reason for this is that in Bradford, they force anyone who isn't muslim out of their path (claiming this is the way of their religion) and are sometimes even violent towards them, because they believe in Sharia law, forced marrages and "living by the sword".

This is my account of the strict Muslim community that has (and is) taking over the city I grew up in. It is not an attempt to steriotype Muslims because I know most of them are good, but the ones I have been directly affected by were like this. They opposed British law and wanted the of Sharia law in England. They were also members of the same Mosque that the London bombers attended and did not oppose what they did when asked.

Dakota
09-24-2006, 02:04 PM
There is always a little bit of truth in stereotypes.

2wings
10-26-2006, 09:20 AM
I live in the middle East, alot of my friends are muslims eg. LS im ok with tehre religion, they respect my religion, i respect theres. We dont talk about religion at all its all peaceful here. I'd just like to say that not all muslims are terrorists.

Rohypnol
10-26-2006, 05:55 PM
I live in the middle East, alot of my friends are muslims eg. LS im ok with tehre religion, they respect my religion, i respect theres. We dont talk about religion at all its all peaceful here. I'd just like to say that not all muslims are terrorists.

First off, I don't think you should have restarted this thread.:oops:
Thats 100000000000% true, not ALL muslims are terrorists but for me its getting VERY difficult for me to talk to a muslim like a normal person.

I don't get it. The muslims say "You are calling us violent:angry:" "we are not violent:angry:" to show you how non violent we are we will burn down a Church.:rolleyes:

AmericanTreeFrog
10-26-2006, 06:47 PM
Actually, Muslim terrorists are quite possibly the worst kinds of racists. Simply, bombing and killing people of another religion is no different than what the Nazis did to the Jews, along with many other people. It's this whole idiotic fantasy that makes them think their race/religion/government is superior to anything else, so everything else should be eliminated.

Believe it or not, most Al Qaeda members are actually students being force fed propaganda, very similar to what new members of the Nazis were fed during their younger years. An Arabic or other Middle Eastern child isn't born into the world with hate and the desire to exterminate all other religions except their own, they are taught it by someone else. Hence, this is the reason why it's wrong to hate all people of Islamic faith. The ones that need to be targeted are the leaders teaching members of Al Qaeda and other terrorist groups this information, they're the ones that are trying to gain power, and using their religion as an excuse for doing so. Meanwhile, devout members of the Islamic faith are believing them on behalf of their religion, thinking this is what their religion is really all about. But its not, just look at the peaceful members of the Islamic faith that don't get involved with terrorism.

It's the peaceful members of the Islamic faith that need to be the role models here, not the terrorist ones.

Neo I agree with you one-hundred percent because I'am part Jewish and My great grandparents were persucuted by the nazis because of their race and beliefes the same exact thing the muslems are doing.

pokeman
10-27-2006, 02:08 PM
First off, I don't think you should have restarted this thread.:oops:
Thats 100000000000% true, not ALL muslims are terrorists but for me its getting VERY difficult for me to talk to a muslim like a normal person.

I don't get it. The muslims say "You are calling us violent:angry:" "we are not violent:angry:" to show you how non violent we are we will burn down a Church.:rolleyes:

the bad muslims are the one who do that but the proper muslims are good that is what islam says to be peacful

LS
10-27-2006, 02:30 PM
I think everyone that thinks we should "grow up" should just shut up.. I'm muslim and I dont have time to deal with fools like you.

pokeman
10-27-2006, 02:34 PM
Ya me too (i am a muslim)

Rohypnol
10-27-2006, 05:38 PM
I think everyone that thinks we should "grow up" should just shut up.. I'm muslim and I dont have time to deal with fools like you.

I didn't say to grow up because not all muslims are bad. There are bad apples in every religion but the muslim bad apples have to be the worst.

pokeman
10-27-2006, 06:57 PM
y r bad muslims the wrost?

Rohypnol
10-27-2006, 08:27 PM
y r bad muslims the wrost?

Because the bad muslims are terrorists.

PokéJungle
11-16-2006, 12:36 PM
I think everyone that thinks we should "grow up" should just shut up.. I'm muslim and I dont have time to deal with fools like you.
Then encourage others in your religion to actually follow what it says.

(ie: the crazies who blow up planes)

Spinner
11-17-2006, 10:16 AM
Oh, this is all a big mess. What you must understand, is that mud is being flung from both sides of the fence. Muslims don't just think "Hmmm.. I think I'll blow up the London underground today" they are provoked in some way or another. We, as non-Muslims must give up our prejudices, before we can expect kindness in return. However, both sides will have to make the effort to go halfway each, and sadly it dosn't look like many people are that willing..:sad: :cry:

PokéJungle
11-17-2006, 10:27 AM
I'd give them slack if they acted rationally.

But terrorists don't, which is why they're terrorists and not martyrs.

Dragon Hunter
11-17-2006, 11:40 AM
Regarding to the thread title, many of my cousins ARE reading this.

Look, my school is filled with students and teachers who have different religions. Hinduists, Buddhists, Christians, Catholics, Muslims, and many more. And there was not even an argue between students or teachers about our religion.

Yup, not even a single one. My family are muslims. We live in a block FILLED with christians. My dad has been working with his two christian friends at a garage, and my mom and her hinduist friend are both florists, and they both own a shop, TOGETHER.

Me? I've had a sleep-over with my buddhist friends at their houses, and i didn't care what they did. Even when they're praying.

It was the Pope's fault for his comments, it was the terrorist's fault they bombed everywhere, it was Bush's fault for starting a useless war, it was MY fault for stealing her food (out of topic).

So there's only one word to recover this war:
PEACE.

PokéJungle
11-17-2006, 02:38 PM
Of course religions can get along well together. I'm a Christian in a Buddhist/Shinto country at the moment.

The real problem is people who take their religion as an excuse to take the lives of innocents. There's nothing honorable or any remotely usable reason for terrorism. It's a sick mutation of their religion, and by staying silent against the injustice of it all, the other Muslims do absolutely nothing to help it. If you really think peace can help the world, I'd say that you need to make sure people realize that terrorists are actively defiling your religion for their own bloodlust and irrationalizations.

At least, if I were Muslim, that's what I would be doing. I've always been one for political and religous movements.

Dragon Hunter
11-17-2006, 04:22 PM
Of course religions can get along well together. I'm a Christian in a Buddhist/Shinto country at the moment.

The real problem is people who take their religion as an excuse to take the lives of innocents. There's nothing honorable or any remotely usable reason for terrorism. It's a sick mutation of their religion, and by staying silent against the injustice of it all, the other Muslims do absolutely nothing to help it. If you really think peace can help the world, I'd say that you need to make sure people realize that terrorists are actively defiling your religion for their own bloodlust and irrationalizations.

At least, if I were Muslim, that's what I would be doing. I've always been one for political and religous movements.

The Muslim religion seperates into two groups. One of them living in non-muslim parts of the world and the other one, in muslim countries. There are 75% of muslims who are against the Muslim enragement. Yes, 75% of Muslims hate the way the muslim terrorists are attacking America and other countries.

There are also news of Saddam Hussein who is going to be hanged for using the Iraqi for attacking America. Am I happy? Maybe. Why maybe? Because Saddam Hussein is a muslim but he did something terribly wrong and illegal, especially treating the Americans as "racists" of the Muslim Region.

The Sunni people (the one living in non-muslim countries) have been taught not to follow the terrorists. I have also been taught not to follow this crap, since i live in peaceful Malaysia.

The terrorists are only bringing shame towards our religion. It is the wrong way, and the Al-Quran (a book similar to the Bible, but for Muslims) has said that these doings are wrong and against the teachings.

I am in neither side of the fence, the Americans or even the Iraqi. I've decided to see how this war ends, either in a good way or a bad way. In peace or continuously in chaos.

PokéJungle
11-17-2006, 04:33 PM
Sadaam actually did very little to the United States, had nothing to do with terrorists, and had absolutely no weapons of mass destruction.

The Iraq War is a fool's war.

Alonso
11-17-2006, 09:22 PM
Regarding to the thread title, many of my cousins ARE reading this.

Look, my school is filled with students and teachers who have different religions. Hinduists, Buddhists, Christians, Catholics, Muslims, and many more. And there was not even an argue between students or teachers about our religion.

Yup, not even a single one. My family are muslims. We live in a block FILLED with christians. My dad has been working with his two christian friends at a garage, and my mom and her hinduist friend are both florists, and they both own a shop, TOGETHER.

Me? I've had a sleep-over with my buddhist friends at their houses, and i didn't care what they did. Even when they're praying.

It was the Pope's fault for his comments, it was the terrorist's fault they bombed everywhere, it was Bush's fault for starting a useless war, it was MY fault for stealing her food (out of topic).

So there's only one word to recover this war:
PEACE.

With what he has said now, he is completely right. The world's problem is not political or religious. The world's problem is economical. My history teacher said that and she even gave us the example of Jesus Christ. There was a point where they asked him about the taxes of Ceaser. Then he responded "give Ceaser that which belongs to Ceaser and to give to God that which belongs to God." Something along those lines. Ceaser got pissed at how Jesus was messing with his economic business and wanted to kill him.

Professor Geoffrey
11-30-2006, 10:10 PM
My mom and I say that it's just plain wrong that the Christians (meaning all religions beliving in God) cannot express their religions because the Muslims say that offends them. I don't care! People had to take down pictures and stuff of Jesus, and that is just plain retarded. Amendment I (I think) freedom of religion; why are we different? We should be able to express our religion. So, if you have an email, and you belive in God, I have this cool song called : "In God we still trust". Just PM me if you want it. I am a confedential person, and I never tell lies. Well, there was this one time..... Kidding! Back to my wonderful speech; we should be able to belive in who we want. Even some of my friends who don't belive in God but have a different religion respect that. We all have different belifs, unless we are emulating someone. It's our choice. I am starting to belive that America isn't the most free country in the world. Instead, I am seeing people gabbing about that talking about God offends them. It's time we fight back. My mom thinks they are going to take down our country motto; it's on evrey coin, evrey dollar bill, on almost evrey check: In God We Trust. I rather be taken over by Britain than not have freedom of religion. In fact, I'd rather die. That is how much I trust God. That is who I am. *bows*

Leman
11-30-2006, 10:26 PM
Sadaam actually did very little to the United States, had nothing to do with terrorists, and had absolutely no weapons of mass destruction.

The Iraq War is a fool's war.

no duh Bush skrewed up big time

Professor Geoffrey
11-30-2006, 10:28 PM
no duh Bush skrewed up big time

I fail to see how Bush did anything wrong. I am just not aware of evreything. Yet, sometimes I think I can't wait for his term to be up. But I definitely don't want Hilary for president. I don't want to waste money on her thinking evreyone should have health care. Peice of ----. Sorry for my french. I won't do it again!

Ham and Cheese
11-30-2006, 10:29 PM
There are so many things wrong with your post, I dunno where to start.

My mom and I say that it’s just plain wrong that the Christians (meaning all religions believing in God) cannot express their religions because the Muslims say that offends them.

Okay. First of all, just because somebody believes in God does NOT mean they’re Christian. Christian people believe in the Holy Trinity, the Bible, that Jesus Christ was the son of God, etc. Some—hell, a lot—of religions don’t believe that. And what about the agnostics?

Second, you’re making it sound like the Islam don’t believe in God. They do, actually. Ever hear of ‘Allah’? Then, I think you mean ‘opinions’ instead of ‘religions.’ The Islam aren’t offended by the Christians being Christians—they’re offended by what the Christians SAY about them.

I don’t care! People had to take down pictures and stuff of Jesus, and that is plain retarded.

Uh…where’d this happen? Besides, if they hang up pictures of Jesus somewhere besides a church or something like that, then shouldn’t they put up a picture of Muhammad? That would make sense, right? And saying that you don’t care is kind of immature.

Amendment I (I think) freedom of religion; why are we different? We should be able to express our religion.

This didn’t happen in America, just to let you know.

I am a confedential person, and I never tell lies.

Oh come ON. You’ve had to have told a lie if not once in your life, for the sake of your sanity. I just find it incredibly unbelievable that nobody ever tells lies.

Back to my wonderful speech

Well we’re feeling cocky, aren’t we?

My mom thinks they are going to take down our country motto; it's on evrey coin, evrey dollar bill, on almost evrey check: In God We Trust. I rather be taken over by Britain than not have freedom of religion. In fact, I'd rather die. That is how much I trust God. That is who I am. *bows*

Honestly.
It’s been this way since goodness knows how long—since back when we became a free country. Do you think that a tradition that’s been established for hundreds of years is going to have an overnight change, if one at all?

Thought so.

And I really don’t understand your last part—that is how much I trust God? Elaborate, please.

Leman
11-30-2006, 10:37 PM
Christians arn't the only ones Muslims hate. Pakistani Muslims have been attacking us Hindus for 60 years for a plot of barran land! Muslums dont like Christians because of the Crusades and thats totaly reasonable.

Professor Geoffrey
11-30-2006, 10:41 PM
There are so many things wrong with your post, I dunno where to start.



Okay. First of all, just because somebody believes in God does NOT mean they’re Christian. Christian people believe in the Holy Trinity, the Bible, that Jesus Christ was the son of God, etc. Some—hell, a lot—of religions don’t believe that. And what about the agnostics?

Second, you’re making it sound like the Islam don’t believe in God. They do, actually. Ever hear of ‘Allah’? Then, I think you mean ‘opinions’ instead of ‘religions.’ The Islam aren’t offended by the Christians being Christians—they’re offended by what the Christians SAY about them.



Uh…where’d this happen? Besides, if they hang up pictures of Jesus somewhere besides a church or something like that, then shouldn’t they put up a picture of Muhammad? That would make sense, right? And saying that you don’t care is kind of immature.



This didn’t happen in America, just to let you know.



Oh come ON. You’ve had to have told a lie if not once in your life, for the sake of your sanity. I just find it incredibly unbelievable that nobody ever tells lies.



Well we’re feeling cocky, aren’t we?



Honestly.
It’s been this way since goodness knows how long—since back when we became a free country. Do you think that a tradition that’s been established for hundreds of years is going to have an overnight change, if one at all?

Thought so.

And I really don’t understand your last part—that is how much I trust God? Elaborate, please.


Please do not criticize me. Basically, I know that their are multiple relions for God. I am just basically saying evreyone in general that belives in God is a Christain so I don't have to say evrey single religion that belives in God. Do you? I thought so. I am also saying they were forced to put down their pictures of Jesus, and Muhamad is not in the Bible! And yes, the freedom of religion DID happen in America. The lying part, I was just joking, are you a perfectionist? The trusting God part, I'd rather die than be forced to not express my religion publically. And yes, the get rid of In God we trust thing, yeah, I do belive in an overnight change. Things can change on a dime. Yes, I am kind of feeling cocky today, because I donated 65 coats/sweaters/long-sleeves to my school Coat drive. :cool: I am talking about the bold meaning. So BACK off.

sonickid01
11-30-2006, 10:41 PM
What's wrong with Islam? What's wrong with Christianity? What's wrong with Religion? What's wrong with Hinduism? What's wrong with the world?

Religion is a choice. It is just deciding which plane to take up to God. Who the hell cares if someone's got a different relgion than yours? It doesn't matter.

Take a look at ALL religions. They ALL say that every human's objective is to go to heaven (or paradise or whatever you want to call it). God intended for humans to live peacefully with one another.

The way I see it, it's not the religion that's messed up. It's the person. "The Good Samaritan." Ever heard of it? In the Holy Bible, there is a story in which a guy is half beaten to death, for all you who haven't heard of it. A priest comes along and ignores him. Some other people come along and are perfectly able to help the guy, but pass by. Then this Samaritan comes along and gets the guy to an Inn, right? What did we learn? And yet, we have people all over the world saying, "Hey you! Over there! Are you (Insert religion here)? No? You're going to hell, you know that, right? 'Cause all people who aren't (Insert religion here) are."

All men are equal individuals. They should have a choice in their religion.

Muslims are not the devil. They are merely different in their thinking.

Go ahead, flame me.

Oh, and the closest friend I have is of Pakistani descent. I'm Indian. But whaddayaknow? We don't kill each other. I think the worst thing I've ever said to him is something like, "dork; Yu-gi-oh doesn't have a cousin. Jaden is NOT Yugi's cousin." Wow, I am a nerd.

Leman
11-30-2006, 11:02 PM
Oh, and the closest friend I have is of Pakistani descent. I'm Indian. But whaddayaknow? We don't kill each other. I think the worst thing I've ever said to him is something like, "dork; Yu-gi-oh doesn't have a cousin. Jaden is NOT Yugi's cousin." Wow, I am a nerd.

not the point the point is that people seem to over look us Indians the view of the world

Professor Geoffrey
11-30-2006, 11:05 PM
What's wrong with Islam? What's wrong with Christianity? What's wrong with Religion? What's wrong with Hinduism? What's wrong with the world?

Religion is a choice. It is just deciding which plane to take up to God. Who the hell cares if someone's got a different relgion than yours? It doesn't matter.

Take a look at ALL religions. They ALL say that every human's objective is to go to heaven (or paradise or whatever you want to call it). God intended for humans to live peacefully with one another.

The way I see it, it's not the religion that's messed up. It's the person. "The Good Samaritan." Ever heard of it? In the Holy Bible, there is a story in which a guy is half beaten to death, for all you who haven't heard of it. A priest comes along and ignores him. Some other people come along and are perfectly able to help the guy, but pass by. Then this Samaritan comes along and gets the guy to an Inn, right? What did we learn? And yet, we have people all over the world saying, "Hey you! Over there! Are you (Insert religion here)? No? You're going to hell, you know that, right? 'Cause all people who aren't (Insert religion here) are."

All men are equal individuals. They should have a choice in their religion.

Muslims are not the devil. They are merely different.

Go ahead, flame me.

Yeah, I heard of the good samaritain. A guy passes an injured man, ignores him, anoth passes, same thing, then a kind hotel (or something like that) comes over, and nurses him back to health, gies him food, water, and money. I donated 65 coats! Do you know how many people will be warmer this Winter? Over a 1000! Why? Because our school donated over (don't know how much) coats. This is done by class. The class who gets the most coats in gets a pizza party (I didn't do it for pizza), and the evrey-year teacher got mad because of my class, I think. My teacher and I are new to the school, so hopefull we kicked butt so lots of people can stay warm this winter.

p.s. Great speech! But am not saying Muslims are the devil. I am just saying that they are the cause of these shenanigans. I am not saying they are a devil religion-wise, but being a bad sport of not thinking that we have religions and feelings too.