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Surly Professor
09-20-2006, 07:37 PM
http://www.crystalinks.com/milkmiracle.html
http://www.milkmiracle.com/

They called it the Ganesh Milk Miracle.
Back on September 21 1995, all around the world statues of the Hindu deity Ganesha began drinking milk. Documented by many, many people, including myself these statues of stone, clay, & metal actually consumed the milk offered to them.

My art teacher at the time Mrs.Patel had a small stone Ganesha; much like the one pictured in the first link, but smaller, about the size of a clenched fist. During the hour long class this small carved stone had absorbed through it's trunk about a half liter of milk a spoonful at a time; more than the total mass of the stone. There was no hole in it, it wasn't leaking, or attached to anything else. I actually held it in my hand and fed it milk.
I still don't know quite what to make of it. I was in school at the time, and already highly sceptical, and a young magician well aware of illusionary techniques and the power of suggestion, but I am stumped trying to find an out of the "miracle" explanation.

So anyway, I was thinking about this today, and did some reading. The Hindu Priests say that this isn't the first time that a miracle like this has happened, (Bare in mind that Hinduism is the oldest of earth's major religions. They trace thier roots back over 5,000 years.) and that miracles like this happen when a great soul decends to earth. A "great soul" being a Buddha or Jesus caliber person, who can change the world in a very signifigant way. So if the hindu priests are on the money this person should be 11 years old tomorrow. Interesting notion.

So, my search for either an explanation of this event, or the 11 year old great one continues.

Happy Birthday great soul where ever you are...

Neo Emolga
09-20-2006, 07:52 PM
Do they prefer skim, whole, 1%, or chocolate milk? Okay, that was a dumb joke, I know...

Well, this is why I don't place too much stock in science, since I feel there are things that can not be explained no matter how many laws of physics we try to apply to everything. The world is too complex to ever fully understand, hence... why such things such as ghosts or angels recieve speculation.

And yet... another thing I managed to find was this (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/04/20/national/main689630.shtml). Coincidence? Maybe... maybe not. But the thing here is... I think too many people easily dismiss anything that isn't tied with science as coincidence or a joke. A modern day miracle? Could Jesus Christ really have turned water into wine and create enough loaves of bread and fish to feed a crowd of people? I'd like to believe the answer is yes.

It's food for thought. Even after having Doppler 4 Trillion, we still can't predict the weather accurately. Some things can be explained by science while others can not, which in the end, science is still simply patterns of observation.

We live in a mysterious world, and I feel we will never know all the answers...

Marth
09-20-2006, 08:24 PM
Do they prefer skim, whole, 1%, or chocolate milk? Okay, that was a dumb joke, I know...

Well, this is why I don't place too much stock in science, since I feel there are things that can not be explained no matter how many laws of physics we try to apply to everything. The world is too complex to ever fully understand, hence... why such things such as ghosts or angels recieve speculation.

And yet... another thing I managed to find was this (http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2005/04/20/national/main689630.shtml). Coincidence? Maybe... maybe not. But the thing here is... I think too many people easily dismiss anything that isn't tied with science as coincidence or a joke. A modern day miracle? Could Jesus Christ really have turned water into wine and create enough loaves of bread and fish to feed a crowd of people? I'd like to believe the answer is yes.

It's food for thought. Even after having Doppler 4 Trillion, we still can't predict the weather accurately. Some things can be explained by science while others can not, which in the end, science is still simply patterns of observation.

We live in a mysterious world, and I feel we will never know all the answers...
For stuff like the one you mention, Neo, try seeing Penn & Tellers Bullzit show. They pretty much demostrate that people see stuff everyone, they show a piece of ham to 100 people, and only one finds it to have the "shape" of Jesus.
But the Milk Drinking statue is a first timer for me... indeed, happy birthday to that great soul.

Neo Emolga
09-20-2006, 08:31 PM
For stuff like the one you mention, Neo, try seeing Penn & Tellers Bullzit show. They pretty much demostrate that people see stuff everyone, they show a piece of ham to 100 people, and only one finds it to have the "shape" of Jesus.
But the Milk Drinking statue is a first timer for me... indeed, happy birthday to that great soul.

Good point... but I do think that one image looks incredibly close to the painting someone featured in that same picture.

I don't think anyone really knows for sure...

Surly Professor
09-20-2006, 09:43 PM
I think this is a little bit different from the typical 'seeing an image of the virgin' "miracle".

Like I've explained in a couple of other threads before; all of these images of Jesus, and the Virgin, and the Hamburgler are just people seeing images of faces. We human beings are trained to recognize faces from the time that we can see. So we will recognize the image of a face, even if it only slightly resembles one, anywhere we find it, whether it be on the trunk of a tree, or a screen door, or the surface of Mars.

I do think that one image looks incredibly close to the painting someone featured in that same picture.
If I had a digital camera I could show you a place where one of my dogs chewed on a door stop that looks just like the IwoJima memorial, just like it. Is it just a coincidence, or is my dog a huge WWII buff?



Even the loaves & fishes "miracle" could have easily been slight of hand.
Just sayin' it isn't a particularly difficult trick especially with an enthusiastic audience. Just sayin'.

"The Ganesh Milk Miracle" is different from this example, because; this happened in the modern day, and it happened everwhere simultaneously. It was observed & recorded by millions of people of many different religions all around the world at once.
And two: I didn't watch someone else do it from the audience, I did it myself, I fed the statue from my own hand, and I'm still at a loss to explain it.

But in the end, science is all we really know, everything else is faith, faith in something unknowable.
And to me, there is nothing unknowable, just... not yet known.



BTW here's a link to the Wiki page.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hindu_milk_miracle

Wiki attributes the "miracle" to capillary action, or the milk's surface tention causes it to flow out of the spoon and down the front of the statue to the floor, which it clearly did not do in my experience.

gun6
09-20-2006, 10:24 PM
O.o... You can see the milk running down the front of the statues in the milkmiracle.com video. >_>

That is pretty cool though. (haha... non-believer :o)

Surly Professor
09-20-2006, 11:47 PM
O.o... You can see the milk running down the front of the statues in the milkmiracle.com video. >_>
Yeah, some of those people were awfully sloppy. They're overly excited I guess, and I see where people would get the idea that capillary action explains it all, and I'ld probably go along with that explaination too... had I not done it for myself.
We might have spilled a couple drops, but only drops... out of a half liter.
Where did the rest go?

Neo Emolga
09-21-2006, 01:22 PM
Even the loaves & fishes "miracle" could have easily been slight of hand.
Just sayin' it isn't a particularly difficult trick especially with an enthusiastic audience. Just sayin'.

Maybe, but still, what if they did have video recorders, digital cameras, and all the modern day tools that we have now to document it? Getting it down on paper was the most they could do. "This just in, Jesus Christ has risen from the dead. Here's Dan Rather's great ancestor, reporting, live at the scene." Yeah, you see my point.

But... that doesn't mean it didn't happen.

"The Ganesh Milk Miracle" is different from this example, because; this happened in the modern day, and it happened everwhere simultaneously. It was observed & recorded by millions of people of many different religions all around the world at once.
And two: I didn't watch someone else do it from the audience, I did it myself, I fed the statue from my own hand, and I'm still at a loss to explain it.

Okay, but what if you were there two thousand years ago listening to the teachings of Jesus Christ, and you witnessed these miracles first hand as well? Don't you think you would have had the same feelings as you do now?

Again, recorded by millions of people. Just because they didn't have the luxury of being able to use video cameras doesn't mean it never actually took place.

But in the end, science is all we really know, everything else is faith, faith in something unknowable.
And to me, there is nothing unknowable, just... not yet known.

Science is flawed though. We still can't predict weather patterns, there are so many theories and even then, modern medicine isn't able to understand everything. Science is just observations of patterns put into practice. It will never tell all either.

Nature has always dominated over science, and always will. The most science can do is try to understand it to at least some degree.

Surly Professor
09-22-2006, 12:14 AM
Science is flawed though. We still can't predict weather patterns, there are so many theories and even then, modern medicine isn't able to understand everything. Science is just observations of patterns put into practice. It will never tell all either.
These aren't flaws though, it's just the state of things right now.
One of the real beauties of science is that it builds apon itself. New discoveries are always being made, improving our base knowledge.
As the pieces of the puzzle reveal themselves they are put into the big picture. We might have to take out a piece that we thought you had right in the first place, but we are making progress. And we are making progress at an ever increasing rate.
It's something like Moore's law... If you follow the graph into the future it's just astounding how vast our knowledge will one day be. Omnipotent even in some views. there's a very interesting book out there called "The Physics of Immortality" where the author proposes that one day in the distant furure, the technology of human being's will be so great that we actually invent god & an afterlife. :eek: indeed; but if the line on the graph is completely vertical, with no end in sight... ... ... ?