Unacceptable

[.AzureLight]

Note: The file I saved on your moves was accidently deleted, so I'm going by what I remember. Contact me if I got yur move wrong.

Turn 3 of 7
--------
Houndoom uses Solar Beam on Milotic.
Killik's Milotic .9
Milotic uses Hydro Pump on Tyranitar.
OnlineHost: Kyuubi RAWR121 rolled 1 100-sided die: 92
Miss
Muk uses Brick Break on Houndoom.
Rilian's Houndoom 3.2
[n]Killik's Milotic .9[/b]
Lan's Tyranitar 9.1
ATF's Muk 8.9
Sun-2
moves?
That was the original turn, sent at 3:19 PM EST.

Half an hour later:
I mis-interpreted a move. I'll re-do the round.

Turn 3 of 7
--------
Houndoom uses Solar Beam on Milotic.
Killik's Milotic .9
Milotic uses Hydro Pump on Tyranitar.
OnlineHost: Kyuubi RAWR121 rolled 1 100-sided die: 61
Hit.
Tyranitar 2.1
Muk uses Brick Break on Tyranitar
Tyranitar killed.
Lan is Eliminated.
The match is OVER, gg to all of you.

There's definitely something I can accuse you of.

[SiberianTiger]

Give it up Lan, he got a move wrong he re-did the thing you lost. If the results turned out the same with Killik about to lose you would have had no problem.

~Isaiah

[.AzureLight]

Give it up Lan, he got a move wrong he re-did the thing you lost. If the results turned out the same with Killik about to lose you would have had no problem.

~Isaiah

Thing is, he forgot the moves sent to him. And ATF could have seen this and been like "Oh, I'm going to change my move to target Lan."

Doesn't explain why he redid Hydro Pump's roll either. He could have just adjusted the target for BB.

[SiberianTiger]

Actually I happen to know for a fact ATF targeted T-Tar. I don't see a reason to bring this before the court because you lost. He messed up he attempted to rectify it, you came out with the short stick.

Edit: ATF says he has the Pm to back it up.

~Isaiah

[.AzureLight]

Actually I happen to know for a fact ATF targeted T-Tar. I don't see a reason to bring this before the court because you lost. He messed up he attempted to rectify it, you came out with the short stick.

Edit: ATF says he has the Pm to back it up.

~Isaiah

Well, doesn't justify why he redid the whole round now, does it?

[SiberianTiger]

That's your opinion. What exactly is it you are accusing Np of anyway? Cheating to make you lose? He made a mistake he tried to fix it by redoing the round. I repeat if the results had stayed the same you wouldn't have had a problem.

~Isaiah

[.AzureLight]

That's your opinion. What exactly is it you are accusing Np of anyway? Cheating to make you lose? He made a mistake he tried to fix it by redoing the round. I repeat if the results had stayed the same you wouldn't have had a problem.

~Isaiah

Hydro Pump shouldn't have been redone. Think when you're correcting an AIM battle. You only redo the move that was wrong.

And yes, it makes a BIG difference. The difference between me winning or not. Muk's BB would leave me with 33% health. So I have all the reason to argue this.

[SiberianTiger]

This was a FFA battle. Safer to just redo the whole thing. I guess it was just to hard to talk to Np about this huh? You haven't taken into acount maybe something else weighed in on his move to redo everything. Now I personally don't know but, just the same.

Answer one thing for me though: If hydro had missed would you still have a problem with this?

~Isaiah

[.AzureLight]

This was a FFA battle. Safer to just redo the whole thing. I guess it was just to hard to talk to Np about this huh? You haven't taken into acount maybe something else weighed in on his move to redo everything. Now I personally don't know but, just the same.

Answer one thing for me though: If hydro had missed would you still have a problem with this?

~Isaiah

Hydro Pump shouldn't have been redone. Think when you're correcting an AIM battle. You only redo the move that was wrong.

And yes, it makes a BIG difference. The difference between me winning or not. Muk's BB would leave me with 33% health. So I have all the reason to argue this.

If he had only corrected BB, I'd be fine. It's the fact he redid Hydro Pump.

[Killik]

What if a move was used to lower the accuracy of a Pokemon? And then say the Pokemon it was used on finished T-tar. Would T-tar still be dead, or would you redo the move that killed him? I would think that it would be better to redo a whole round, rather than pick and choose which moves to redo on a case by case basis.

[.AzureLight]

Let's take a situation.

Free-For-All

Marth's Alakazam
vs
Mike's Arcanine
vs
Ball's Poliwrath
vs
DU's Vileplume

Say Alakazam moves last because he got his speed reduced, and Marth targeted Vileplume with Psychic, but I thought he targeted Arcanine. Do I redo the whole round? NO. I just correct the target of Psychic.

Oh, and guess what: it's the same situation here.

[Killik]

Let's take a situation.

Free-For-All

Marth's Alakazam
vs
Mike's Arcanine
vs
Ball's Poliwrath
vs
DU's Vileplume

Say Alakazam moves last because he got his speed reduced, and Marth targeted Vileplume with Psychic, but I thought he targeted Arcanine. Do I redo the whole round? NO. I just correct the target of Psychic.

Oh, and guess what: it's the same situation here.


There has to be some consistency to the system. If you simply redo the wrong move in one case, but allow you to change two moves in another, there isn't any consistency at all. However, if all the moves are redone, each case can effectively be corrected, and not fixed by what the ref determines is the best course of action.

[SiberianTiger]

The only reason you have a problem with this is because you lost! Quite frankly I could care less how a particular ref, refs. As long as he doesn't cheat, follows the rules and does his job.

Why not just redo the round? You only want it stricken because the first time left you with an advantage.

Now if Np cheated or made it so you would lose that's a different matter. As it stands now, I don't see anything wrong that he did.

Np judged how he thought best you simply don't agree, show me anything he did wrong.

I g2g but I will be following this up.

~Isaiah

[AmericanTreeFrog]

Lan you lost, don't be a sore loser about it, the match was fair Np made a misstake and corrected it. If you have a issue talk to him.

[.AzureLight]

Lan you lost, don't be a sore loser about it, the match was fair Np made a misstake and corrected it. If you have a issue talk to him.



No, sorry, because this involves a higher authority.

[AmericanTreeFrog]

No, sorry, because this involves a higher authority.

I'll see you in court.

[.AzureLight]

I'll see you in court.

We are in court. I want somebody like Marth to determine this. That way I'll know if what CB did was right or wrong, and than I can use it to piss you all off if he was right. :rolleyes:

[AmericanTreeFrog]

I'll win in court, and I'm counter-suing you for slander and libel.

[.AzureLight]

I'll win in court, and I'm counter-suing you for slander and libel.

I'll sue you for treason then. :neutral:

[Marth]

I've got a question in all of this, before actually saying something.
Where's Tyranitar move in the first log? I don't see it there, it just ends the turn without attacking. Did it use Hyper Beam, or something?

[.AzureLight]

I've got a question in all of this, before actually saying something.
Where's Tyranitar move in the first log? I don't see it there, it just ends the turn without attacking. Did it use Hyper Beam, or something?

Yeah. I used Hyper Beam. :rolleyes:

[Killik]

I've got a question in all of this, before actually saying something.
Where's Tyranitar move in the first log? I don't see it there, it just ends the turn without attacking. Did it use Hyper Beam, or something?

Yes, it had used HB the turn before and was therefore unable to attack.

[Loyal Arcanine]

Ok seriously. Time and time again I keep telling people that they need experience to ref FFA's. Do people ever listen? No. I wonder what we do reftests for anyways, if people don't care about the quality of reffing? And CB, this is not against you, this is just the sorry state of URPG.

Either way, you shouldn't have re-rolled Hydro Pump. Apparently some move hit the wrong target, then adjust that and continue. This whole tournament idea is bad. Firstly FFA's on the forum don't work, and second you don't have the quality judging required.

Not much else to say, I can't force this tournament round to be re-done; I wouldn't re-do it actually. It's just sour for Lan and means that people need to stop whining when I tell them they're not good enough to do FFA's.

[Marth]

I still not see the logic in NP's reffing. If you're reffing a FFA, and the last attack is wrong, which has NO influence whatsoever on the other attacks, I wouldn't re-do all the turn. I would simply correct the damage, instead of re-doing all the turn. You don't do a whole cake again if your mistake didn't ruin it; if you put strawberries instead of cherries, remove the strawberries and put the cherries; does no harm on the final result and it's easier than doing everything again.

Now, the law of probabilities says it's more probable that HP hits than actually misses. So, if we correct the first one without doing the whole turn, the second scenario would be the most probable. So HP missing was highly favorable to Lan, and disfavorable to the other 2.

I'd like only to hear NP about the veracity of the first log; the one in which HP misses. If he agrees that it was the original one (mistaken, yes, but HP still missed); then, Lan is right, there was no need to do all the turn again.

Unless Lan concedes a whole turn-redoing, with him in the chat when NP rolls for the accuracy of HP, final result; I'd say he's right, and the turn must be corrected using the HP roll from the first log. This is ONLY if Nasty Plasty agrees that the first turn is valid, and made up.

[Nasty Plasty]

Jesus Christ. If I had any idea this would've happened, I'd just keep the accuracy roll. I wasn't sure myself, so I went to Ball. He can verify that I im'd him and asked if, if I mis-interpreted a move, if it'd be fair to re-do the entire turn? He said that he guessed that'd be fine. But, depending on what the Jury says, I'll either keep the stats the way they were, save for Muk's target, or close C-block down. Lan, you're luckier than most people. At least you got to have a match. When this Tuesday comes, the other 9 people will be eliminated/pass and they won't even get to have the battle. Better to lose a battle than to win something that never happened?

Edit: Sure, I agree. Let it be known that Hydro Pump Did not hit Tyranitar.

[.AzureLight]

I would simply correct the damage, instead of re-doing all the turn. You don't do a whole cake again if your mistake didn't ruin it; if you put strawberries instead of cherries, remove the strawberries and put the cherries; does no harm on the final result and it's easier than doing everything again.

Yeah, Marth owns us all with his gift of uber logic.

I honestly want this to be done right, so I'm going to stand firm with what I'm asking for.

[Marth]

Then Lan may either choose to Re-do the whole turn, or make NP edit the first log of the stats with the BB against T-tar; in which HP missed.
Once you decide, a mod should lock this, I'm going to a party =P

[.AzureLight]

Then Lan may either choose to Re-do the whole turn, or make NP edit the first log of the stats with the BB against T-tar; in which HP missed.
Once you decide, a mod should lock this, I'm going to a party =P

Yeah, we've got this all sorted out. Thanks Marth. :oops: