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Go Back   Pokemon Forum - Pokemon Elite 2000 Ľ Pokemon Main Boards Ľ Pokemon: Games Ľ Fourth Generation

Fourth Generation Discuss the fourth generation Pokemon games: Diamond, Pearl, Platinum, HeartGold and SoulSilver.


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  #1  
Old 09-06-2008, 11:42 PM
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Default The Mindset of Competitive Battling

The Mindset of Competitive Battling
By Kevin Garrett and Limitless


Introduction:
Have you ever wished that you could think like an expert? To be able to know when to predict, and how to make the right decision in a competitive battle? Some of those people that we worship may be Husk, Jrrrrrr, Iggybot, Pulse or who ever, but they all have the same things in common. They all have the same mindset. They all know when to predict, and when not to. Through Kevin and mineís couple of years, we have observed and documented many of their techniques and frames of minds. So in this guide, we would like to show you, the PokeBeach Community, how to have the correct and most successful mindset for competitive battling.

Experience:
Before we start with the core of the subject, we would like you to know a few things first. These things will help nurture your mindset, and help your overall record in competitive battling. First things first, we whole heartedly believe that almost everything in battling or really, anything in life, you have to experience first hand. You canít really make a decision about something, until you actually test it. Our techniques that we will be showing you, are proven by us and plenty other people, that this guide actually does work. That doesnít mean that you will be a star after the first battle. You have to really go through the school of hard knocks. You have to have the battling scars. In all actuality, when you first make a successful team, it honestly isnít all that successful. For any team could be a 50-0 team. You first have to lose with it, to get the hang of it. The heart of the team relies in how to counter specific pokemon, while working around the rest. Six pokemon will not counter the whole metagame no matter how you look at it. For instance, if you borrow a team from someone else, the logical thing to do would be to watch them battle for a good hour. The reason why I say this is because you want to know what they can counter, and what they have to work around. You have to know, what pokemon they try to keep for later in the game, just incase something decides to pop up in the end, and sweep your whole team. For instance, if your team is completely weak to Mamoswine, with Celebi as your only lines of defense, it would be logical to keep it above 50% Hp, and actually alive. That being said, donít keep it locked up waiting just for that specific pokemon. Which leads us into the next section.

Thinking Ahead:
Thinking ahead in a competitive battle, is one of the most important aspects. It is honestly more important than prediction. Prediction? How can it be more important than prediction you say? Prediction is actually extremely overrated. I canít say enough, how when you predict, your in a sense flipping a coin. You have no control over the battle what so ever. When your in a battle, you want to be in control. Even sometimes when Iím down 6-3, in my mind Iím still in control. The reason I say this, is because I still have my motive, my motive is still possible. My motive and yours, should/and will be to win the match. However, more specifically, my motive is to sweep with Choice Scarf Garchomp. I knew that once I had weakened a couple of his pokemon to a certain percentage, I would be able to Outrage all day long. However, most people would just give up at the sight of that score. Being up that high, also creates a safety net in your opponentís mind. They think, meh, a couple of mistakes wonít really hurt my chances of winning the match. When in all actuality, that is what will make him lose the match. That is why you should never in the course of a battle, think subconsciously in your mind, that you will lose the battle. For once you think you will lose, you will most definitely lose. The pokemon that you end up with later in the match to sweep, may not be the pokemon that you intend on sweeping with. For instance, Kevin had a match where he was down 6-3. He ended up sweeping with only Heatran left. That is not the pokemon him, or anyone for that matter, would in their right mind think would be sweeping the match. When your thinking ahead in battles, you sort of get the feeling of what their team is weak to. So even though you have something to sweep with at the end, you really have to adjust your style of play to keep attacking their weak spot.

Prediction:
In observing Jrrrrrr in plenty of battles, he almost never predicts. He only predicts when there is only roughly 2 or 3 moves left in the match. However, at that point, it really isnít prediction. It is really luck. Luck that you get from guessing on what their prediction is. It is a 50/50 guess, that could go either way. Would you like a 50/50 chance of winning the match? That is why Jrrrrrr never predicts. That is something that will be a dagger in plenty of your hearts because you were taught that prediction is the way of experts. When in all reasoning, it is the heart of amateurs. What we do a lot of times is sacrifice things just to scope out their Pokemon. Once we know all their Pokemon, it's a good chance we can't lose. Because we know we can outplay them and since there are no surprises, there will be nothing to catch us off guard. That being said, you always should be keeping track of your opponents pokemon. You have to know what their strategy is also. Otherwise, you could be putting yourself into their trap. You have to know what your opponent is thinking to win any match. Another example how prediction is foolish is where Kevin was in a tussle with his Celebi against a Heatran. His opponent was trying to make predictions left and right, so how did Kevin adjust to that? He stayed in. He let his opponent make a foolish prediction, which made him lose the match. Kevinís opponent used Earth Power that gave Kevin a free move. A free move to give himself the advantage to stay in control of the match. There are two things in this game. Foolish players predict. Good players know.

Playing Smart:
Also, we believe fully, that your team is only as good as your greatest weakness. Which is something that you have to look at. Like my team right now, Mamoswine and Deoxys are huge troubles. However, they are only a problem if Celebi and Metagross are gone. I don't care if you have 5 pokemon left, if Celebi is gone, Mamoswine will sweep. If you see that weakness, you shouldnít let Mamoswine die early. You shouldnít force it to kill anything. Anything that you canít OHKO should be something that you honestly donít attack. You should switch out. This is something that goes hand in hand with thinking ahead in a competitive match. For you see, if someone forced the issue with Celebi with Mamoswine, they would have just cost them a chance of sweeping my whole team. Let me say that again, you shouldnít force anything because you could be giving up a sweep of your opponentís whole team. Scoping teams is exactly how you make this frame of mind effective. You have to know when to pull out, and when to stay in to take the hit. An example of a dumb player for instance, is where the ATKG team is extremely weak to MoP Heracross. So Kevin was using the team on Official. He came up with a match against a MoP heracross. The guy let himself get OHKOíd by a Outrage from ScarfChomp, just because he had a couple of Sword Dances in. That is the prime example of an extremely dumb player. His mentality was just to let it die, because heís all set up. You cannot do that, and expect to win the match. The only reason you should ever sacrifice things is when it would give you no more mutual advantage in a match. That being said, it is the prime way to scout your opponentís team.

Free Switch-Ins:
While coming closer to the end of this guide, we have pretty much covered the relations to thinking ahead in a match. However, there is one more thing that you should know about. First of all, you shouldn't send out a pokemon when you know that you could get countered right away to put you in a horrible position. I am mainly talking about offensive teams here. For instance, if Bronzong is a issue to your team, and you send out Mamoswine to take out Tyranitar. Now, you saw Bronzong the first turn. So it is obvious that since you sent out Mamoswine, he will send in Bronzong. Now since most of your team is offensive, you in a sense have to sacrifice one of your pokemon just because you sent out Mamoswine in relation to something else. Now for instance, lets say that you have Gengar. You would be much better off sending that out to Hypnosis, Focus Blast, Substitute or what ever. Therefore you wouldn't be caught in a bad situation. I can't tell you how important sending in pokemon through a match is another percentage of how you win/lose the match. Once again, this is primarily for offensive teams, but it still is in correlation with defensive and stall teams. This goes back to being in control of the match. If you prevent your opponent from getting the upper hand due to a switch or a key move, you are obviously in control. Thinking ahead in a match isn't about predicting, it is about avoiding key mistakes/situations that you may incur.

Closing Words:
Iíd like to point out to everyone, that the way you play a team is 7/10 of the reason you either lose or win the match. Yes, I am saying that only 3/10 is part of team building. I could give a number 1 shoddy team to a complete noob, and he would still be a complete noob. That being said, even if I gave it to someone such as Husk, he would still fail at the team. He would only fail at the team for a certain amount of time because he knows that you have to know how to play the team. If you have Life Orb Gyarados, and send it in early in all your matches, you will not win the match. That is used to soften up a sweep for later in the match. If they just restore all the damage through the match, your epic sweeping monster was meant for nothing. You might as well have not even have brought it into the match. That in of itself is another frame of mind. You have to know when to send in something to actually make the pokemon effective. You have to get each of your pokemon to have the max potential in all of your matches. For if you donít, you wonít have your max potential, which wonít give you your max potential battling record/results. Just remember all of this when you are thinking about sacrificing your Garchomp just because he already has a Swords Dance in, or just because one of your pokemon only has 20 percent health left.
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  #2  
Old 09-08-2008, 05:44 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

good guide the only thing i really have to say is to always be mindful of stealth rocks and spikes. I can't tell you how many times on shoddy i've seen someone switch in pokemon to SR just to get them killed from the switch itself.
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Old 09-10-2008, 12:30 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ulazlo View Post
good guide the only thing i really have to say is to always be mindful of stealth rocks and spikes. I can't tell you how many times on shoddy i've seen someone switch in pokemon to SR just to get them killed from the switch itself.
That would be in the lines of common sense.
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Old 09-18-2008, 02:31 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

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Originally Posted by Limitless View Post
That would be in the lines of common sense.
I love this guide LL. It helped me alot. Thanks for the guide bro.
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  #5  
Old 09-19-2008, 04:30 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

I like the guide it's pretty good it should help out noobs and more expierienced battlers alike. It's always good to know your teams major weaknesses so you can find ways to fix it.
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  #6  
Old 09-20-2008, 02:02 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

Quote:
Originally Posted by _Kankuro_ View Post
I love this guide LL. It helped me alot. Thanks for the guide bro.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Vincent_Valentine_4 View Post
I like the guide it's pretty good it should help out noobs and more expierienced battlers alike. It's always good to know your teams major weaknesses so you can find ways to fix it.
Thanks guys. It took Kevin and I awhile to make it.
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Old 10-04-2008, 12:25 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

I'm not going to comment largely, because I have prior to this post.

In my opinion, you can't have a mindset, really, except that you play however works for you. If you battle enough, you realize that most of the actually good battlers play a way that works for them exclusively. This would include Katsura, Stone-- among others.
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Old 10-04-2008, 02:57 PM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

It's an ok guide, but it all depends on how you feel at the time your playing. Its all about luck and you need to know how your opponent plays.
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Old 10-05-2008, 03:49 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

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Originally Posted by Insane View Post
It's an ok guide, but it all depends on how you feel at the time your playing. Its all about luck and you need to know how your opponent plays.
Well, it's also how you play. Luck is pokemon, essentially. The only reason we can even predict is because guides like this actually limit ones style, therefore making strategies predictable. =)

Bottom line is, because we started deeming things as standard or effective, things became dull and predictable.
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Old 10-09-2008, 02:53 AM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

Quote:
Originally Posted by Led Zeppelin View Post
Well, it's also how you play. Luck is pokemon, essentially. The only reason we can even predict is because guides like this actually limit ones style, therefore making strategies predictable. =)

Bottom line is, because we started deeming things as standard or effective, things became dull and predictable.
I'm not limiting anyone's style of play. I'm just per say expanding the horizons.
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Old 10-18-2008, 07:34 PM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

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Originally Posted by Trinity View Post
I'm not limiting anyone's style of play. I'm just per say expanding the horizons.
No, you're saying you have to do certain things to win. Anything like that will limit one's thinking at a point in time.
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Old 10-19-2008, 03:31 AM
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No, you're saying you have to do certain things to win. Anything like that will limit one's thinking at a point in time.
I suppose you're right. It just all depends on how gutsy you are, and weighing risk verses reward.
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Old 10-21-2008, 09:24 PM
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Default Re: The Mindset of Competitive Battling

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The Mindset of Competitive Battling
By Kevin Garrett and Limitless


Introduction:
Have you ever wished that you could think like an expert? To be able to know when to predict, and how to make the right decision in a competitive battle? Some of those people that we worship may be Husk, Jrrrrrr, Iggybot, Pulse or who ever, but they all have the same things in common. They all have the same mindset. They all know when to predict, and when not to. Through Kevin and mine’s couple of years, we have observed and documented many of their techniques and frames of minds. So in this guide, we would like to show you, the PokeBeach Community, how to have the correct and most successful mindset for competitive battling.

Experience:
Before we start with the core of the subject, we would like you to know a few things first. These things will help nurture your mindset, and help your overall record in competitive battling. First things first, we whole heartedly believe that almost everything in battling or really, anything in life, you have to experience first hand. You can’t really make a decision about something, until you actually test it. Our techniques that we will be showing you, are proven by us and plenty other people, that this guide actually does work. That doesn’t mean that you will be a star after the first battle. You have to really go through the school of hard knocks. You have to have the battling scars. In all actuality, when you first make a successful team, it honestly isn’t all that successful. For any team could be a 50-0 team. You first have to lose with it, to get the hang of it. The heart of the team relies in how to counter specific pokemon, while working around the rest. Six pokemon will not counter the whole metagame no matter how you look at it. For instance, if you borrow a team from someone else, the logical thing to do would be to watch them battle for a good hour. The reason why I say this is because you want to know what they can counter, and what they have to work around. You have to know, what pokemon they try to keep for later in the game, just incase something decides to pop up in the end, and sweep your whole team. For instance, if your team is completely weak to Mamoswine, with Celebi as your only lines of defense, it would be logical to keep it above 50% Hp, and actually alive. That being said, don’t keep it locked up waiting just for that specific pokemon. Which leads us into the next section.

Thinking Ahead:
Thinking ahead in a competitive battle, is one of the most important aspects. It is honestly more important than prediction. Prediction? How can it be more important than prediction you say? Prediction is actually extremely overrated. I can’t say enough, how when you predict, your in a sense flipping a coin. You have no control over the battle what so ever. When your in a battle, you want to be in control. Even sometimes when I’m down 6-3, in my mind I’m still in control. The reason I say this, is because I still have my motive, my motive is still possible. My motive and yours, should/and will be to win the match. However, more specifically, my motive is to sweep with Choice Scarf Garchomp. I knew that once I had weakened a couple of his pokemon to a certain percentage, I would be able to Outrage all day long. However, most people would just give up at the sight of that score. Being up that high, also creates a safety net in your opponent’s mind. They think, meh, a couple of mistakes won’t really hurt my chances of winning the match. When in all actuality, that is what will make him lose the match. That is why you should never in the course of a battle, think subconsciously in your mind, that you will lose the battle. For once you think you will lose, you will most definitely lose. The pokemon that you end up with later in the match to sweep, may not be the pokemon that you intend on sweeping with. For instance, Kevin had a match where he was down 6-3. He ended up sweeping with only Heatran left. That is not the pokemon him, or anyone for that matter, would in their right mind think would be sweeping the match. When your thinking ahead in battles, you sort of get the feeling of what their team is weak to. So even though you have something to sweep with at the end, you really have to adjust your style of play to keep attacking their weak spot.

Prediction:
In observing Jrrrrrr in plenty of battles, he almost never predicts. He only predicts when there is only roughly 2 or 3 moves left in the match. However, at that point, it really isn’t prediction. It is really luck. Luck that you get from guessing on what their prediction is. It is a 50/50 guess, that could go either way. Would you like a 50/50 chance of winning the match? That is why Jrrrrrr never predicts. That is something that will be a dagger in plenty of your hearts because you were taught that prediction is the way of experts. When in all reasoning, it is the heart of amateurs. What we do a lot of times is sacrifice things just to scope out their Pokemon. Once we know all their Pokemon, it's a good chance we can't lose. Because we know we can outplay them and since there are no surprises, there will be nothing to catch us off guard. That being said, you always should be keeping track of your opponents pokemon. You have to know what their strategy is also. Otherwise, you could be putting yourself into their trap. You have to know what your opponent is thinking to win any match. Another example how prediction is foolish is where Kevin was in a tussle with his Celebi against a Heatran. His opponent was trying to make predictions left and right, so how did Kevin adjust to that? He stayed in. He let his opponent make a foolish prediction, which made him lose the match. Kevin’s opponent used Earth Power that gave Kevin a free move. A free move to give himself the advantage to stay in control of the match. There are two things in this game. Foolish players predict. Good players know.

Playing Smart:
Also, we believe fully, that your team is only as good as your greatest weakness. Which is something that you have to look at. Like my team right now, Mamoswine and Deoxys are huge troubles. However, they are only a problem if Celebi and Metagross are gone. I don't care if you have 5 pokemon left, if Celebi is gone, Mamoswine will sweep. If you see that weakness, you shouldn’t let Mamoswine die early. You shouldn’t force it to kill anything. Anything that you can’t OHKO should be something that you honestly don’t attack. You should switch out. This is something that goes hand in hand with thinking ahead in a competitive match. For you see, if someone forced the issue with Celebi with Mamoswine, they would have just cost them a chance of sweeping my whole team. Let me say that again, you shouldn’t force anything because you could be giving up a sweep of your opponent’s whole team. Scoping teams is exactly how you make this frame of mind effective. You have to know when to pull out, and when to stay in to take the hit. An example of a dumb player for instance, is where the ATKG team is extremely weak to MoP Heracross. So Kevin was using the team on Official. He came up with a match against a MoP heracross. The guy let himself get OHKO’d by a Outrage from ScarfChomp, just because he had a couple of Sword Dances in. That is the prime example of an extremely dumb player. His mentality was just to let it die, because he’s all set up. You cannot do that, and expect to win the match. The only reason you should ever sacrifice things is when it would give you no more mutual advantage in a match. That being said, it is the prime way to scout your opponent’s team.

Free Switch-Ins:
While coming closer to the end of this guide, we have pretty much covered the relations to thinking ahead in a match. However, there is one more thing that you should know about. First of all, you shouldn't send out a pokemon when you know that you could get countered right away to put you in a horrible position. I am mainly talking about offensive teams here. For instance, if Bronzong is a issue to your team, and you send out Mamoswine to take out Tyranitar. Now, you saw Bronzong the first turn. So it is obvious that since you sent out Mamoswine, he will send in Bronzong. Now since most of your team is offensive, you in a sense have to sacrifice one of your pokemon just because you sent out Mamoswine in relation to something else. Now for instance, lets say that you have Gengar. You would be much better off sending that out to Hypnosis, Focus Blast, Substitute or what ever. Therefore you wouldn't be caught in a bad situation. I can't tell you how important sending in pokemon through a match is another percentage of how you win/lose the match. Once again, this is primarily for offensive teams, but it still is in correlation with defensive and stall teams. This goes back to being in control of the match. If you prevent your opponent from getting the upper hand due to a switch or a key move, you are obviously in control. Thinking ahead in a match isn't about predicting, it is about avoiding key mistakes/situations that you may incur.

Closing Words:
I’d like to point out to everyone, that the way you play a team is 7/10 of the reason you either lose or win the match. Yes, I am saying that only 3/10 is part of team building. I could give a number 1 shoddy team to a complete noob, and he would still be a complete noob. That being said, even if I gave it to someone such as Husk, he would still fail at the team. He would only fail at the team for a certain amount of time because he knows that you have to know how to play the team. If you have Life Orb Gyarados, and send it in early in all your matches, you will not win the match. That is used to soften up a sweep for later in the match. If they just restore all the damage through the match, your epic sweeping monster was meant for nothing. You might as well have not even have brought it into the match. That in of itself is another frame of mind. You have to know when to send in something to actually make the pokemon effective. You have to get each of your pokemon to have the max potential in all of your matches. For if you don’t, you won’t have your max potential, which won’t give you your max potential battling record/results. Just remember all of this when you are thinking about sacrificing your Garchomp just because he already has a Swords Dance in, or just because one of your pokemon only has 20 percent health left.
Perfectly true, perfectly useful and pefectly said (Ryan claps), welll done Trinity! This a fantastic peice of writting, i have enjoyed reading it and the scence it makes.


One thing I will ask is, would agree fighting opponents beter than you gives you a wealth of knowlage whare as a win against a weaker opponet could not? Sorry if you mentioned something similar or like this in the passage I often have a habbit of overlooking things.

Last edited by Master Aqua; 10-21-2008 at 09:31 PM.
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