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  #16  
Old 08-05-2012, 11:57 AM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

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I fail to see how you fail to see. The only thing one needs to be saved is faith - like you said, you have to assume you can be saved.
That idea is immoral. It like saying, "Oh, well, you committed an act of evil in God's name, but since you actually believed it was what God wishes, you get to go to heaven."

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It may look like a poor argument, but it's true. The commandments were/are separate from the Old Testament covenant, and would thus have to be tossed separately if at all.
The reason it is a poor argument is that the Ten Commandments are the Decalogue of Mosaic Law.

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That is true, and homosexuality, so far as I know, was not nearly so prevalent back then as today; compared with the state of one's eternal future it would likely have then seemed less important to teach the people. But you're forgetting that while condemnation of homosexuals is not written all over the bible, the proper marriage format is. One man and one woman, simple and pure.
It was not prevalent because it was punishable by death up until the 20th in western society, and is still punishable by death in many other countries.

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But you are not using the similar passages that balance responsibilities between the woman and the man. Anyway, you're forgetting that according to the Bible, God made the world and is sovereign. Whoever's in charge - i.e. God - gets to define good. Something that seems perfectly acceptable to the world may be a sin. Christians are, like it or not, called to a higher standard than the world, which is corrupted by sin. But this goes into the whole 'sovereign God' debate, and that could drag on for days and days.
You have entered the "Problem of Evil" argument, and it only resorts to the three big "O's" of the Judeo-Christian God (interestingly enough, the Hebrew God did not share these properties at all). The problem with omniscience, omnipotence, and omnibenevolence is that they all contradict each other, or themselves.

And the only answer the religious can give is, "We cannot understand God." Not only would this not work in any debate (it is an admission of defeat), but it is also hypocritical, considering all the hoops people already go through to defend their God and explain his reasoning.


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First of all, the man is called to be the spiritual leader. Flat out. A woman is supposed to submit to him, but not, I think, in the way that you suppose. It does not give a man the right to make a slave out of his wife. The man has responsibilities to the woman as well.
That is not only false when you simply look at history, but it does not make any specific mention of it in an only "spiritual" matter. Let us remember that the woman was an afterthought of God's anyway.

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A husband is supposed to love his wife, and let's state the biblical implications of love...
Ah, but we are going by our definition of love. Love can be whatever God defines it for his own personal means. Is it not said that the Bible is corrupted by man?

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A husband who loves his wife in the true and proper way will not be self-seeking. He will be loving, giving, and protecting to his wife, and will treat her well. The man and woman have different roles. The woman is the supporter, the man the protector. Maybe this seems sexist, but that's the way it is. I'm not sure I can prove to you that genders are 'equal' according to the bible. They are supposed to be complements to each other, rather than the same. But both genders have a crucial role to play in the body of Christ, and that's good enough for me at least.
It is sexist, and you have no way to prove that, socially, that is the way it is. Special pleading at its greatest.

You cannot prove in anyway that the Bible is not sexist, and that is the problem. There is no justification for it.


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Originally Posted by Velocity View Post
You forget that this selfsame God is also stated to be just.
You forget that unicorns are said to be real.


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Originally Posted by Velocity View Post
Hmm... That one I'm not entirely sure of, to be honest. That's an interesting topic. If what that person is doing does not contradict the Bible, then who knows? Going so far as to kill somebody in God's name, though, is just foolish. 'Thou shalt not kill' is in the Ten Commandments for a reason.
Really? Thou shalt not kill, eh?


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Natural Disasters are God's Wrath

Nahum 1:2-8

The LORD is a jealous God, filled with vengeance and wrath. He takes revenge on all who oppose him and furiously destroys his enemies! The LORD is slow to get angry, but his power is great, and he never lets the guilty go unpunished. He displays his power in the whirlwind and the storm. The billowing clouds are the dust beneath his feet. At his command the oceans and rivers dry up, the lush pastures of Bashan and Carmel fade, and the green forests of Lebanon wilt. In his presence the mountains quake, and the hills melt away; the earth trembles, and its people are destroyed. Who can stand before his fierce anger? Who can survive his burning fury? His rage blazes forth like fire, and the mountains crumble to dust in his presence. The LORD is good. When trouble comes, he is a strong refuge. And he knows everyone who trusts in him. But he sweeps away his enemies in an overwhelming flood. He pursues his foes into the darkness of night.
Quote:
Pillage and Plunder

Nahum 2:2-10

For the land of Israel lies empty and broken after your attacks, but the LORD will restore its honor and power again. Shields flash red in the sunlight! The attack begins! See their scarlet uniforms! Watch as their glittering chariots move into position, with a forest of spears waving above them. The chariots race recklessly along the streets and through the squares, swift as lightning, flickering like torches. The king shouts to his officers; they stumble in their haste, rushing to the walls to set up their defenses. But too late! The river gates are open! The enemy has entered! The palace is about to collapse! Nineveh's exile has been decreed, and all the servant girls mourn its capture. Listen to them moan like doves; watch them beat their breasts in sorrow. Nineveh is like a leaking water reservoir! The people are slipping away. "Stop, stop!" someone shouts, but the people just keep on running. Loot the silver! Plunder the gold! There seems no end to Nineveh's many treasures – its vast, uncounted wealth. Soon the city is an empty shambles, stripped of its wealth. Hearts melt in horror, and knees shake. The people stand aghast, their faces pale and trembling.
You cannot justify this. "Turn the other cheek." If God told you (and you knew it was God) to brutally murder your children, would you do it?
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Last edited by Teddiursa of the Sky; 08-06-2012 at 01:26 PM.
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  #17  
Old 08-05-2012, 03:33 PM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

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HOWEVER, Ty, might I share something I was told by the nice Jehovah's witness lady who would visit my family for an hour or so every Wednesday for the past year and talk about the Bible with us? You talked about the whole thing with why God hasn't stopped Satan from creating evil--what she told us was this: God didn't stomp out Satan or the evil created by him because Satan thought he was better than God, and God is allowing Satan to create evil on Earth "for now" so that he can prove to all that Satan is not a better ruler, and will "soon" eliminate Satan's evil and make Earth a paradise, "as it was meant to be." As nice as this all sounds, I'm not firmly convinced this is true, but I thought I'd just share a different answer to that with you.
Why would he let him do that though? An all powerful "God" would know that "Satan" wasn't a better ruler, and would know that his people would know. That's still not beneficial to anyone, so I doubt an omnibenevolent "God" would let that happen. I'm not much for explaining this, but I hope you get the gist. XDD
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  #18  
Old 08-05-2012, 08:38 PM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

I get the point you're trying to make, and I was just sharing something shared with me, however I think her point was this: He's not trying to prove to himelf or his people that he is a better ruler, he's trying to prove to Satan (who thinks he's a better ruler than god) that he is a better ruler. He's trying to show Satan that his beliefs are wrong, and also set an example for all to come why he is a better ruler so no one becomes like Satan ever again. It's not like he intends to allow Satan to run things forever, and (according to the Jehovah's Witnesses, anyway) when he does get rid of Satan, he intends to make the Earth a paradise again.

I'm not the person who said this, nor am I really religious, so I can't do much more than tell you what I took out of it, but much like you said, I hope that makes sense.
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  #19  
Old 08-05-2012, 11:31 PM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

Yes, it makes sense. c: I get what you're saying. My response to her is that why does "God" have to prove that to Satan? It doesn't make sense that he would hurt his people just to prove a point. That's like beating your children in front of the other parent to prove you're better. Doesn't make much sense. XD
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  #20  
Old 08-06-2012, 01:04 AM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

As I said before and you seemed miss or ignore, my best guess would be to do it to prevent something like that from happening in the future. However, I'm not sure what her answer would be, and unfortunately I won't be seeing her again for some time...maybe Winter break, but I dunno. If I remember, I'll ask her and get back to you...but honestly, I wouldn't count on me remembering. My memory regarding anything other than something I've written, read, played through, or watched sucks pretty tremendously.
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  #21  
Old 08-06-2012, 01:20 AM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

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As I said before and you seemed miss or ignore, my best guess would be to do it to prevent something like that from happening in the future. However, I'm not sure what her answer would be, and unfortunately I won't be seeing her again for some time...maybe Winter break, but I dunno. If I remember, I'll ask her and get back to you...but honestly, I wouldn't count on me remembering. My memory regarding anything other than something I've written, read, played through, or watched sucks pretty tremendously.
What I'm getting is that you didn't say that, and that you're not religious and etc. I'm just responding to her.

What did you mean?
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  #22  
Old 08-06-2012, 01:28 PM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

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As I said before and you seemed miss or ignore, my best guess would be to do it to prevent something like that from happening in the future. However, I'm not sure what her answer would be, and unfortunately I won't be seeing her again for some time...maybe Winter break, but I dunno. If I remember, I'll ask her and get back to you...but honestly, I wouldn't count on me remembering. My memory regarding anything other than something I've written, read, played through, or watched sucks pretty tremendously.
But God is supposedly omnipotent, omniscience, and omnibenevolent. He would have no reason to do so. If that is what we are talking about here.
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  #23  
Old 11-11-2013, 06:52 PM
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Default Re: Christian Feminists? Oh, the irony.

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