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Orthar
04-17-2006, 02:09 AM
I saw this thread a while back and I want to know if people opinons have chnaged or some new opinions that have risen(sp?) My question to you all is What are your opinions on homosexuals, you know gays, bis, lesbos, all of those catagories and any I forgot. I really want to hear what you people have to say, once someone has brought up their opinion I might pop in here and there and express what I feel and well err debate lol.

Matt
04-17-2006, 02:33 AM
Why is there even a controversy? Name one good reason homosexual people should not have one right that anybody else does.

Orthar
04-17-2006, 02:38 AM
Why is there even a controversy? Name one good reason homosexual people should not have one right that anybody else does.
Exactly my thoughts. I myself am Bi-Sexual and Homosexuals are still people. Therefore I belive they fall under the laws and bill of rights. They might act different at times but can be extremely succesful and funny aswell. Yet being Homosexual is hard. Many reasons like discrimination. I mean you cannott deny someone a job becuase of how the act, dress, ect. That is unjust and shouldn't be aloud yet it is.

gun6
04-17-2006, 03:06 AM
Homosexuality is treated like a different race some of the time... it's just scary. It's just racism and the majority picking on the minority. I find no problem in homosexuality though. They're just people... like everyone else.

Neo Emolga
04-17-2006, 03:13 AM
Truthfully, I have no problem with it, as long as homosexuals don’t try to force their feelings upon someone that is heterosexual, and vice versa. I’ll respect your feelings but respect mine and don’t change them.

!CeMAn
04-17-2006, 03:27 AM
Truthfully, I have no problem with it, as long as homosexuals don’t try to force their feelings upon someone that is heterosexual, and vice versa. I’ll respect your feelings but respect mine and don’t change them.

That is so the cop-out reply. I hate it when people say "Oh i don't have a problem with homosexuals - as long as they don't hit on me or try and make me gay.". That's up there with "I'm not racist, BUT.."

How many times have you actually had a homo try and 'force their feelings on you', Neo?

Orthar
04-17-2006, 03:30 AM
Truthfully, I have no problem with it, as long as homosexuals don’t try to force their feelings upon someone that is heterosexual, and vice versa. I’ll respect your feelings but respect mine and don’t change them.
Look say a homosexual is hitting on you, i'd just think of them as a girl/guy that you don't have feelings like that for. If a girl/guy you don't like hits on you it's fine, but if a gay guy does it it isn't? Thats a bit odd if you ask me.

!CeMAn
04-17-2006, 03:38 AM
I've had dudes flirt with me, it's no big deal. They're pretty good at being able to tell i'm not interested. They move on, no big deal. Hell, i'm flattered.

Orthar
04-17-2006, 03:45 AM
I've had dudes flirt with me, it's no big deal. They're pretty good at being able to tell i'm not interested. They move on, no big deal. Hell, i'm flattered.
Yeah, It doesn't take anything away from you and you shouldn't feel un comfortable, just go along with it and they'll get the picture.

Elmo's Heaven!!
04-17-2006, 03:45 AM
Even though many people think that little 10 year olds are really immature about homosexuality, I myself ain't. Many kids say "Eww, gross!" whenever you say gay or lesbian or whatever. I don't because I respect other people's opinions on life and, well, "that's their life, and not yours!! Worry about your own, cuz you need to!!"

Thank you for your patronage. I have been wanting to say that for a long time.


EDIT: The Boogeyman... posted the same time I did... Dun Dun DUN!! lol

NightBreaker
04-17-2006, 12:27 PM
Well, homos are people like everyone else and deserve the same rights like everyone else. Everyone has a different point of veiw and homosexuality is just another point of veiw. People reject the act because they don't find it appealing from their standpoint and others tolerate it because they either understand the difference between people or just don't aknowledge it.

So I say, it's their bodies ... kinda ... so they can do what they want with it. They can make their own decisions like other people and don't need strict doctors telling them they're sick and which way to go. That's how life is in our world. We can't change that. And since we can't, the best thing to do is accept it.

Neo Emolga
04-17-2006, 12:42 PM
That is so the cop-out reply. I hate it when people say "Oh i don't have a problem with homosexuals - as long as they don't hit on me or try and make me gay.". That's up there with "I'm not racist, BUT.."

How many times have you actually had a homo try and 'force their feelings on you', Neo?

None, if you want an honest answer.

But my point being is if they try, they shouldn't get annoyed if I say no, and that I'm hetrosexual.

miyoun
04-17-2006, 12:46 PM
I myself is bisexual. You'll be shocked, but basicly, everyone in my year are homophobes.

I also can't even walk down the halls in a small crowd without people going,

"Are you bi?"
"OMG ARE YOU BI WITH NICOLE?" (My reply to that is, "ew no. Shjes just my freaking friend)

Actually, in slag matches, they fight back with, "haha your bi"

Being homosexual is a privelage imo. :/ But I'm just insane. 8D

KTHXBAI

Matt
04-17-2006, 01:27 PM
Meh, people are dumbas.ses when it comes to knowing other people. I think Iceman has it down pat.

Ultimate Tiger
04-17-2006, 01:40 PM
There is nothing wrong with Homosexuals IMO they should be treated the smae as everybody else.

Loyal Arcanine
04-17-2006, 04:12 PM
That is so the cop-out reply. I hate it when people say "Oh i don't have a problem with homosexuals - as long as they don't hit on me or try and make me gay.". That's up there with "I'm not racist, BUT.."

How many times have you actually had a homo try and 'force their feelings on you', Neo?
Wtf cop-out reply.

There is nothing wrong with Homosexuals IMO they should be treated the smae as everybody else.

That's a cop-out reply too. I can find myself perfectly in Neo's statement. I might react more ... agressively if a dude makes a move on me than if a girl did. But since homosexuals should be accepted the way they are, you should do that with me too. :ninja:

Orthar
04-17-2006, 09:49 PM
Wtf cop-out reply.



That's a cop-out reply too. I can find myself perfectly in Neo's statement. I might react more ... agressively if a dude makes a move on me than if a girl did. But since homosexuals should be accepted the way they are, you should do that with me too. :ninja:
Well if you tell them no, the rest would more likley be kidding around. BAsing your opinon on gay people hitting on you is weak. If you say no, then they'll get the picture. But don't like freaking mistreat them or anything. No need to yell, would you yell if a girl you didn't like was hitting on you? No. Just treat it the smae way.

Seven
04-17-2006, 10:24 PM
Hm, what I don't get about homosexuality is how people tolerate negative "opinions" about it. Sure everyone's entitled to his/her own views, but some opinions are just plain wrong. Like white people being superior to black people for example. And like gays being <wrong> and straights being <right>.
As far as I'm concerned, people who are opposed to gays and their rights hold an objectively wrong opinion.

But I'm glad to see so many people here don't have a problem with it.

NightBreaker
04-17-2006, 11:41 PM
Wtf cop-out reply.



That's a cop-out reply too. I can find myself perfectly in Neo's statement. I might react more ... agressively if a dude makes a move on me than if a girl did. But since homosexuals should be accepted the way they are, you should do that with me too. :ninja:
I'd go crazy even if a guy would hit on me. The three that were brave enough to try are currently suffering casualties except for one, who I am willing to forget, but my friends have been haunting me about him ever since they found out.

If you look at it, some people view a person being part of the green party as a person would view a homosexual. It our human view, and most of us share that same view. It's kinda like being cluttered at the window of a tank with sea lions in it. Everyone sees the sea lions in a different point of view and some aren't pleased with what they see and want to change that view to something they find more appealing.

But, to be honest, I may find the whole idea of homosexuality a bit unnatural, but for the sake of others' feelings, I'm willing to tolerate it.

!CeMAn
04-17-2006, 11:53 PM
Wtf cop-out reply.

I couldn't think of a better word. Maybe hypocritical? Just didn't sound right at the time :tongue:.

I might react more ... agressively if a dude makes a move on me than if a girl did.

WHY? Are you scared you might become aroused if a man touches you, flirts with you or smiles seductively at you?? There iS a word for that, you know :wink:. Oops, i winked at you! You're not going to react aggressively, are you?


You know, as terrifying as it is to imagine another man chasing you around trying force his parts in your face, it's not likely to happen. At least, not any more likely than a random straight man doing it to another woman. What irritates me, is it seems like people have this conception of homosexuals being unpredictable same-sex fiends that will pounce at any time.

Matt
04-18-2006, 12:01 AM
I'd go crazy even if a guy would hit on me. The three that were brave enough to try are currently suffering casualties except for one, who I am willing to forget, but my friends have been haunting me about him ever since they found out.

So are you homosexual or just prude?

NightBreaker
04-18-2006, 12:05 AM
So are you homosexual or just prude?
Exactly what makes you think I'm homosexual? *glares angrily and storms off to get mana*

Prude? Me? Yeah right. If you saw me at my school, you would know that I'm not prude within ten seconds.

Orthar
04-18-2006, 12:15 AM
Exactly what makes you think I'm homosexual? *glares angrily and storms off to get mana*

Prude? Me? Yeah right. If you saw me at my school, you would know that I'm not prude within ten seconds.
Have no fear, Boogeyman is here!

Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Earth .... I think
Gender: Female
Posts: 495

NightBreaker
04-18-2006, 12:17 AM
Have no fear, Boogeyman is here!

Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Earth .... I think
Gender: Female
Posts: 495
Thank you, boogey, you can't even imagine how angry I get when my gender is in question. *eye twitch*

Matt
04-18-2006, 12:39 AM
I knew you were a girl! I just figured, since you said you hurt guys or get pissed when they hit on you, I figured that you are either attracted to girls instead of guys, or you don't like to have relationships/be with guys because you are afraid. When did I hint at you being a guy?!

Orthar
04-18-2006, 12:41 AM
I knew you were a girl! I just figured, since you said you hurt guys or get pissed when they hit on you, I figured that you are either attracted to girls instead of guys, or you don't like to have relationships/be with guys because you are afraid. When did I hint at you being a guy?!
I think since her story was about guys but I'm not sure. IMO people who are afraid of gay people hitting on them shouldn't. Just brush it off andthey'll stop. It hsouldn't effect you that big. What about what gay gay marridges an dstuff. What are your opinions on that stuff?

NightBreaker
04-18-2006, 01:29 AM
I knew you were a girl! I just figured, since you said you hurt guys or get pissed when they hit on you, I figured that you are either attracted to girls instead of guys, or you don't like to have relationships/be with guys because you are afraid. When did I hint at you being a guy?!
My bad, then. I misunderstood your post, but I'm not a homo. Just a girl who likes a guy and gets creeped out whe a guy asks her out, especially one who is 8 and the other who kept naked pictures of women in his desk and wrote bad words over my calculator when I was sick one day. I'd rather not say who the third is, though ...

Either way, I'll just return to the discussion topic.

I'm not so sure of what my opinion of gay marriage is. I do believe that people have a right to do what they want, but we have to draw the line somehwere. Where to draw the line is the question, though.

Seawolf
04-18-2006, 03:10 AM
But, to be honest, I may find the whole idea of homosexuality a bit unnatural, but for the sake of others' feelings, I'm willing to tolerate it.

You do know that homosexuality has been around for thousands of years, right? Hell, there have even some species of animals reported that display homosexual behavior. In all honestly, I find it quite natural - I guess it's just different from "the norm" and what we might've been brought up to think about them.

I'm not even going to get into how much religion has gotten into this debate, because I'll just make people angry. I'll just say that thanks to certain religious sects, homosexuality is seen as "evil" and "wrong", which I find terribly sad. How would you feel if everyone thought that you should die and go to hell or whatever just because you're straight? It's just so stupid to me. Sexual orientation should not be a factor in determining in how we judge people.

Just for the record, I am bisexual. I've dated both men and women and have not felt "weird" being with other girls. It just felt...right. I feel the same way with them as I do being with men. They're all human, after all.

Matt
04-18-2006, 03:14 AM
What the religious sects don't realize is that it's not a choice. It has something to do with the spacing of the hemispheres of the brain or something, something that cannot be changed. Organized religious groups are so STUPID. All of them!

This is why I'm atheist.

Seawolf
04-18-2006, 03:39 AM
What the religious sects don't realize is that it's not a choice. It has something to do with the spacing of the hemispheres of the brain or something, something that cannot be changed. Organized religious groups are so STUPID. All of them!

This is why I'm atheist.

Indeed.

This is why I'm Buddhist. ;)

!CeMAn
04-18-2006, 05:50 AM
What about what gay marriages and stuff. What are your opinions on that stuff?

Like D.2 said earlier, i don't even understand why there is controversy. Who really cares who you're marrying? I mean, there are children starving to death every day and it actually takes an entire fleet of "politicians" to decided whether Joe Homosexuality can marry his long time lover, Johnny Catcherzmitt?? Again, i ask: Who really gives a crap?

NightBreaker
04-19-2006, 10:13 PM
You do know that homosexuality has been around for thousands of years, right? Hell, there have even some species of animals reported that display homosexual behavior. In all honestly, I find it quite natural - I guess it's just different from "the norm" and what we might've been brought up to think about them.
I didn't mean it like that. When I view it, I find it unnatural to myself because all I can see, no matter how hard I try to convince myself that's not the matter, are two very close friends. So, basically, I find how I view homosexuality as unnatural ..... Wow, I just confused msyelf.
Who really gives a crap?
Lots of people do and we can't help it. Nomatter how stupid it seems to deprive people of their rights to choose, most people demand homosexuality as being possessed by a demonic entity or some other religious beast.

All I can do when I view this is wonder why people won't leave each other alone because they don't approve of the other's actions, but now I understand that there will always be conflict. Everyone thinks the grass looks greener somewhere else just as some religious zealots believe everything would be better if a person was straight.

I always looks at these conflicts and wonder why people fight. I always wonder such simple things and get confused of how people talk to or treat each other. Then I get scared and feel alone in the world, as if I'm alien and everyone understands the rules and I'm just there to break them. That's why I find comfort in my religion.

Seawolf
04-20-2006, 05:43 AM
I didn't mean it like that. When I view it, I find it unnatural to myself because all I can see, no matter how hard I try to convince myself that's not the matter, are two very close friends. So, basically, I find how I view homosexuality as unnatural ..... Wow, I just confused msyelf.

You just confused me as well. o_O Have a cookie!

Espeon Rinage
04-20-2006, 06:44 AM
To be honesti dont mind if someone is homosexual, althhough i somtimes use it as a insult

Orthar
04-20-2006, 11:15 PM
To be honesti dont mind if someone is homosexual, althhough i somtimes use it as a insult
Well thats completly arrogant. It shouldn't be used as an insult like "Thats gay" or "Dude you are soooo gay" IT really pisses me off when little kids who have no idea how that can hurt people go around sayin it like "Dude" or "Hi" or "Hey.

!CeMAn
04-21-2006, 03:59 AM
It's a big problem. The word gay is full-on slang these days. I'll admit i say "That is so gay.", from time to time. The catch is, i use it like it has no meaning, like the fook word, or calling random women b!tches. It's just slang, but i'll agree there's something wrong with it in the first place. The same word used to describe somebody's lifestyle shouldn't ever be used as a negative term. Good luck ever changing that though, is the problem. It's too late and so commonly used, that they might as well bend over(no pun intended) and put it in the dictionary.

InvertrevnI
04-21-2006, 04:39 AM
This is funny, just as I open the page, a pop-up appears and wants to know what I think about homosexuals.

Orthar
04-21-2006, 11:03 PM
This is funny, just as I open the page, a pop-up appears and wants to know what I think about homosexuals.
Dude, thats not funny at all......did you have to say that?

RouteMaster
04-22-2006, 09:04 PM
The main problem with homosexuality is that many religions view it as wrong and many people take it upon themselves to enforce that opinion.

I don't know about the US but here in Northern Ireland gay marriage has just become legal, and the first gay marriage in the UK took place in Belfast.
Northern Ireland isn't the most "liberal" or free thinking of places usually sticking to ideals generations old and founded in the Christian religion in both the Protestant and Catholic faiths. If gay marriage can occur in a country like this with a much smaller gay population, why not elsewhere?

Personally, I am a hetrosexual and a Christian, but I firmly believe in the seperation of State and Church, and it is most certainly not my place to inforce my opinions on others, gay or otherwise. After all, the Bible teaches, "judge not lest ye be judged," I think it's simply a case of live and let live. I do have some homosexual friends.

!CeMAn
04-23-2006, 05:51 AM
I've hung out with a few homosexuals and never did they try and hit on me. And i'm quite cute.

Orthar
04-23-2006, 12:01 PM
I've hung out with a few homosexuals and never did they try and hit on me. And i'm quite cute.
Yeah, you claim to have a nice ass. ANyway, I too have hung out with homosexuals at my school and they arent that bad. MOstly they are funny and are always good for a laugh.

Crummie
04-25-2006, 03:31 AM
You know what bugs me? This country was founded on the basis of religious freedom. And now, we have congressmen using the Bible as the reason to which a law should be made to discriminate against a group of persons.

That's pretty gay. Or... Not gay? Whatever. All I know is, I support homosexual marriage.

RouteMaster
04-25-2006, 03:53 PM
You know what bugs me? This country was founded on the basis of religious freedom. And now, we have congressmen using the Bible as the reason to which a law should be made to discriminate against a group of persons.

That's pretty gay. Or... Not gay? Whatever. All I know is, I support homosexual marriage.

You talking about the US?
I completely agree, if people don't like it they like everyone else should be allowed to make their opinion heard, that's democracy.
They SHOULD NOT however be allowed to enforce their opinions (their personal opinions) on anyone else, especially by passing a law which will infringe on so many peoples' choice of lifestyle. I'll say it again, live and let live. I think gay/lesbian couples should have equal rights as straight married couples.

NightBreaker
04-25-2006, 09:13 PM
You talking about the US?
I completely agree, if people don't like it they like everyone else should be allowed to make their opinion heard, that's democracy.
They SHOULD NOT however be allowed to enforce their opinions (their personal opinions) on anyone else, especially by passing a law which will infringe on so many peoples' choice of lifestyle. I'll say it again, live and let live. I think gay/lesbian couples should have equal rights as straight married couples.
I agree. People even want to burn the Declaration of Independence since it dedicates the country 'under God'. In my brother's highschool, any student that talks about God without insulting Him gets detention or a warning, but Muslims are allowed to skip classes for their prayers. Call that religious equality?

People have no right to stamp out homosexuality from the world, because it'll still be there nomatter what. It doesn't matter how hard they try, because people are still gonna be who they are, and we have no right to change that.

Gee, now I think I'm sounding like a democrat.

Dog of Hellsing
04-25-2006, 11:09 PM
I don't care about another person's sexual preferences. I have many gay/les/bi friends and I like them better than most of my straight friends.

On the topic of gay marriage, I say if that's what would make them happy, then by all means let them get married! I don't think anyone else should have a say in who gets married for whatever reason. it just isn't right.

I have one lesbian friend who lives in Florida, and when she used to live here in Columbus I'd stay the night with her all the time. When I was talking to my grandma about it and let it slip my friend was a les, she was like, "She never tried to do anything to you, did she?" I hated that so much, that people think that way about gay people.

I say if you're gay, you're alright in my book. Not to mention it seems gay people are nicer than straight people. I remember my mom used to work at a bar and these two gay guys gave her gifts and gave me money all the time and crap.

gun6
04-25-2006, 11:22 PM
I say if you're gay, you're alright in my book. Not to mention it seems gay people are nicer than straight people. I remember my mom used to work at a bar and these two gay guys gave her gifts and gave me money all the time and crap.

That's because they're used to people spouting this rubbish at them, and they know what it's like to be mistreated. So then, they just help out people because they want people to know that they aren't some lesser species that we can just walk on like a doormat. People should just realize that everybody is a snowflake. Now, you don't see snowflakes killing eachother, or discriminating eachother, huh? They bond together to form something much bigger and better, like a snowball, or a snowman. We need to learn from the snowflakes, world. We all do. - . -

P.S.: It ticks me off when people say that things are gay. I replace "gay" with better things... like... "stupid".

Dog of Hellsing
04-25-2006, 11:31 PM
Dude, that sounds so cool ^^. And I agree with you, people need to be more accepting of others and to learn to bond together easier. So many problems would be solved if people could put aside their differences and hateful views...

NightBreaker
04-26-2006, 12:45 AM
Dude, that sounds so cool ^^. And I agree with you, people need to be more accepting of others and to learn to bond together easier. So many problems would be solved if people could put aside their differences and hateful views...
I heartily agree. If you look at it, most of the wars and important conflicts in the world were started by mistreatment between people or hate. WWI began with the murder of the heir of a country who was currently fighting the home-country of the shooter, the Civil War started with the mistreament of African-Americans, WWII was from Hitler's hate of the Jews. This is just another one of those seemingly small conflicts that'll probably lead to something big.

Dog of Hellsing
04-26-2006, 12:51 AM
*Nods.* Of course it will. Everyone can only take so much crap before they just snap. Sine they're people like everyone else, gays/bis/lesbians are no different. Sooner or later, just wait, a war or something will start when one of them gets tired of the crap they take. It's the ripple effect, you know? Just takes one tiny little stone to create a big wave. *Sigh.* Is it so hard for people to get along? Everyone says that intelligence and sophisticated technology and all make humans the dominate species, the superior race and all. But if this intelligence and mass weaponry only leads to war, hate, pain, suffering, death, destruction....I think maybe it'd be better to be a different animal than a human.

RouteMaster
04-26-2006, 03:51 PM
*Nods.* Of course it will. Everyone can only take so much crap before they just snap. Sine they're people like everyone else, gays/bis/lesbians are no different. Sooner or later, just wait, a war or something will start when one of them gets tired of the crap they take. It's the ripple effect, you know? Just takes one tiny little stone to create a big wave. *Sigh.* Is it so hard for people to get along? Everyone says that intelligence and sophisticated technology and all make humans the dominate species, the superior race and all. But if this intelligence and mass weaponry only leads to war, hate, pain, suffering, death, destruction....I think maybe it'd be better to be a different animal than a human.

In my opinion it is nothing that we have built or created that has made us top of the food chain. That has come directly from our ability for thought and creativity, which set us apart and that has allowed us to come so far as a species. We have achieved so much; good and bad.
It is this ability to think and reason that has led to this debate today and to allow us to be able to stand up for our opinions. However this "creativity" and ability to formulate opinions has left us bitter and divided, notably over the issue of homosexual marriage.
So in conclusion, I agree with Tyranitar Trainer. Everyone has the right to express and have their own opinions and eventually gay/lesbian/bi tempers will snap and there will be a cultural revolution across the developed world.
Also if I had to pick Tyranitar Trainer, I would be an owl.

Vampire
04-26-2006, 04:01 PM
I have no problem with it, and if someone has then 1 good reason why its bad, im sure no one has.

Dog of Hellsing
04-26-2006, 06:00 PM
I'd prefer to be a wolf or an eagle or something.

But you have a good point HM. Humans have made some really good advances in the world, as well as extremely bad ones. I just wish those good advances could overcome the bad ones.

I may not be gay or anything, but trust me, if the time comes when the revolution happens and I'm still alive, I'm going to be siding with the homosexuals. *Shrug.* Sue me if you don't agree, see if I care. I personally believe that it'll be the right of the homosexual community to strike back and stand up for their rights when the time comes.

NightBreaker
04-26-2006, 09:48 PM
*Nods.* Of course it will. Everyone can only take so much crap before they just snap. Sine they're people like everyone else, gays/bis/lesbians are no different. Sooner or later, just wait, a war or something will start when one of them gets tired of the crap they take. It's the ripple effect, you know? Just takes one tiny little stone to create a big wave. *Sigh.* Is it so hard for people to get along? Everyone says that intelligence and sophisticated technology and all make humans the dominate species, the superior race and all. But if this intelligence and mass weaponry only leads to war, hate, pain, suffering, death, destruction....I think maybe it'd be better to be a different animal than a human.
Yep, very few people in the world understand that all our technological advances, even for the sake of helping people, just creates more problems. If we didn't create dyed food when they'd taste just the same without the dye, then we'd have less problems with cancer. Even look at stem cells. If research on it continues, people will only have sex just to abort the baby and sell the body to a Stem Cell Bank like we have a Blood Bank. What type of lifestyle is that? We'd rob decades of years of life from unborn children just to increase our own by a few years? Yeah, we're the most advanced species, not to mention the most selfish :rolleyes:

And I would most definately be a wolf, but things have been going wrong with them lately. Yellowstone National Park's gonna go out a get rid of some of the gray wolves, who are an endangered species, because they are ruining the elk population.

If a war happens, even if my parents disagree, I'll be on the side of the homosexuals, because they're people, too, and they have rights like we do.

Orthar
04-27-2006, 08:45 PM
Yep, very few people in the world understand that all our technological advances, even for the sake of helping people, just creates more problems. If we didn't create dyed food when they'd taste just the same without the dye, then we'd have less problems with cancer. Even look at stem cells. If research on it continues, people will only have sex just to abort the baby and sell the body to a Stem Cell Bank like we have a Blood Bank. What type of lifestyle is that? We'd rob decades of years of life from unborn children just to increase our own by a few years? Yeah, we're the most advanced species, not to mention the most selfish :rolleyes:

And I would most definately be a wolf, but things have been going wrong with them lately. Yellowstone National Park's gonna go out a get rid of some of the gray wolves, who are an endangered species, because they are ruining the elk population.

If a war happens, even if my parents disagree, I'll be on the side of the homosexuals, because they're people, too, and they have rights like we do.
That whole post is so true. I still have no idea why straight people need to be segregated from homosexuals to feel "normal" or why homosexual should or are even segregated.

Dog of Hellsing
04-27-2006, 08:51 PM
Humans fear and hate anything or one different from the accepted norm, and that sadly includes the homosexuals. It's stupid really, truly retarded, to be like that though. I can imagine if it were some sort of self-preservation thing in the past, to be afraid of things humans couldn't understand. But in this day and age the intelligence of humans should give them the ability to overcome such trivial emotions when it comes to the more important feelings of worth and such of others.

TDD91
04-27-2006, 09:05 PM
I've no problem with it at all, loads of my friends are gay/bi/lesbian, an I dont see em any differently. ITs perfectly acceptable IMO, an I wish that society was more relaxed about the whole issue. The Ancient Spartans, one of the most feared civilisations ever, practiced pederasty [gay sex between a young male an a surrogate father] and this made their army a close knit unit, now if such a thing happens it's laughed off as the force being "queer". There's nowt wrong wit it.

Seven
04-27-2006, 10:12 PM
Humans fear and hate anything or one different from the accepted norm, and that sadly includes the homosexuals. It's stupid really, truly retarded, to be like that though. I can imagine if it were some sort of self-preservation thing in the past, to be afraid of things humans couldn't understand. But in this day and age the intelligence of humans should give them the ability to overcome such trivial emotions when it comes to the more important feelings of worth and such of others.

Yeah, the problem is though some prejudices got incorperated in the Abrahamic religions, and especially most believers still hold the values of the Bible/Quran/Torah highly.
So nowadays I don't think it's about fear mostly, it's more about what's considered moral or not (based on religious beliefs).

RouteMaster
04-27-2006, 10:23 PM
Yeah, the problem is though some prejudices got incorperated in the Abrahamic religions, and especially most believers still hold the values of the Bible/Quran/Torah highly.
So nowadays I don't think it's about fear mostly, it's more about what's considered moral or not (based on religious beliefs).

I think people are scared that if these morals are allowed to die out, their whole religion may start to stagnate and die too. This leads to people not being able to accept change in their religions, and therefore a clash with this issue, homosexuality.

!CeMAn
04-27-2006, 11:19 PM
When i was younger, i came up with the theory that homosexuality was nature's way of making us evolve as a species. It's way of controlling our population; Some of us have no desire to mate with the opposite gender. Too bad there aren't more homos in China...

RouteMaster
04-28-2006, 08:38 PM
Interestingly there are homosexuals in nature. I remember reading an article in the scientific magazine "Focus" all about it. It's very rare though but one of the animals I remember was a walrus. Apparently as so few of the males get to mate, a lot of them relieve natural sexual tension through homosexuality activity. So it is definately a natural thing. I agree it could well be a natural programming thing, quite as normal as hetrosexuality.

Thrall
05-02-2006, 11:58 PM
I agree with all you guys but they're will always be someone thats a jerk no matter what.Take America for example The Constitution says all Man Are Created Equally.It's not very true at all.Republicans hate Homosexuals/Lesbians/Bisexuals and won't let them get married . Christians also won't marry them.It's they're choice to be married or not married .My conculsion is Life Isn't Fair .Not everyone agree's with other people on this topic but if your Homosexual/Lesbian/Bisexual your okay in my book.

Red.Falcon
05-03-2006, 12:07 AM
I agree with all you guys but they're will always be someone thats a jerk no matter what.Take America for example The Constitution says all Man Are Created Equally.It's not very true at all. Republicans hate Homosexuals/Lesbians/Bisexuals and won't let them get married(No space here!!! . Christians also won't marry them.It's they're choice to be married or not married No space here!. My conculsion is Life Isn't Fair .Not everyone agree's with other people on this topic but if your Homosexual/Lesbian/Bisexual your okay in my book.
Okay, I am a huge grammar freak, so I underlined some of the unnessesary stuff. Sorry, I needed to. But I am a pretty big religeous person (yeah, I can't spell it...so what?) so I don't really like that sort of thing. But as long as I'm not involved, it's fine with me. If two people love each other, they shouldn't really get married, just...y'know, live in the same house, and stuff that married people do, it's just they aren't legally bonded.

Say, when two guys or girls get married, who changes their last name? Do they flip a coin?

"So, Fancisco, heads...or (girly pout) tails! Hehe! I'm sooo naughty!"
"Ooh, you know what I want....Tails......"
"(Pout) It's heads! Oh, Frans, I want you to change! Heeeheee!"

Sorry, just thinking aloud. No offence to anyone not heterosexual.

Seawolf
05-03-2006, 12:44 AM
Say, when two guys or girls get married, who changes their last name? Do they flip a coin?

"So, Fancisco, heads...or (girly pout) tails! Hehe! I'm sooo naughty!"
"Ooh, you know what I want....Tails......"
"(Pout) It's heads! Oh, Frans, I want you to change! Heeeheee!"

Sorry, just thinking aloud.

That's pretty damn insensitive, seeing as how not everyone on this forum is heterosexual. Keep your mouth shut.

!CeMAn
05-03-2006, 12:58 AM
Okay, I am a huge grammar freak, so I underlined some of the unnecessary* stuff. Sorry, I needed to. But I am a pretty big religious* person (yeah, I can't spell it...so what? So what? So don't dump on other people's grammar when yours isn't the best either. Especially, in this board..) (S*)o I don't really like that sort of thing. But(,)* as long as I'm not involved, it's fine with me.

Yeah, i'm a big grammar freak too.

Seawolf
05-03-2006, 01:12 AM
Yeah, i'm a big grammar freak too.

:D

Hypocrites are funny people, eh?

!CeMAn
05-03-2006, 01:27 AM
:D

Hypocrites are funny people, eh?
Hypocricy is FUN!

Dog of Hellsing
05-03-2006, 07:46 PM
But as long as I'm not involved, it's fine with me. If two people love each other, they shouldn't really get married, just...y'know, live in the same house, and stuff that married people do, it's just they aren't legally bonded.

WTF? Dude, you just said if it doesn't involve you then you don't mind. So how can you turn around and say, "Oh they shouldn't get married even though they love each other"? Exactly why shouldn't they be allowed to marry, hm? It's not involving you, so why should you care? Which you obviously seem to, even though you say you don't.

Hypocricy is FUN!

XD You're gonna get hit for copyright infringment lol.

Zeldarooles
05-03-2006, 07:50 PM
:eek: Wow, I don't know what to say. Honestly, it hadn't ever occured to me that one of these topics might appear on these boards.

Red.Falcon
05-03-2006, 08:52 PM
Quote by- Tyranitar_Trainer WTF? Dude, you just said if it doesn't involve you then you don't mind. So how can you turn around and say, "Oh they shouldn't get married even though they love each other"? Exactly why shouldn't they be allowed to marry, hm? It's not involving you, so why should you care? Which you obviously seem to, even though you say you don't.
--------------------
I know someone's gonna find something wrong with this post, too:

I'm just very religeous, so I'm saying they shouldn't be married, but if I am involved with something like that, I wouldn't really love the person. Sure, a friend, but not like, y'know, dating, stuff that boys and girls should do. But if it is anyone else, sure, I don't care. But I don't think they should be married.

I tried to understand that last sentence, so I'll try and give you an answer: I don't really want them to marry because it goes against the bible. It's kind of like on the Triscuit Crackers box, it shows the crackers, but with tomatoes, and stuff on them. It says "serving suggestion". You don't have to eat them like that. It's a suggestion. That's what I am saying. They don't have to not get married, it's just my opinion.

(Sorry, my backspace button got stuck, and erased the whole "Quote by..." thing, so I made my own little box.)

Seven
05-03-2006, 10:42 PM
I'm just very religeous, so I'm saying they shouldn't be married, but if I am involved with something like that, I wouldn't really love the person. Sure, a friend, but not like, y'know, dating, stuff that boys and girls should do. But if it is anyone else, sure, I don't care. But I don't think they should be married.

I tried to understand that last sentence, so I'll try and give you an answer: I don't really want them to marry because it goes against the bible. It's kind of like on the Triscuit Crackers box, it shows the crackers, but with tomatoes, and stuff on them. It says "serving suggestion". You don't have to eat them like that. It's a suggestion. That's what I am saying. They don't have to not get married, it's just my opinion.


Don't apologize for your opinion, that's silly :P. But what you're saying is: I'd never fall in love with someone of the same sex, ERGO they don't have to get married because I feel uncomfortable with it. And your reason is the Bible? Let me ask you this, would god rather have you live a happy life commited and married to one partner than a live of either unhappiness of promiscuity?(not as if those are the only two options, but you get the point).

Anyway, if my "Father"'d send me to hell for being whatever sexual orientation, I don't accept him as a father anyway, just as a dumb cruel man.

Matt
05-03-2006, 11:35 PM
I'm just very religeous, so I'm saying they shouldn't be married, but if I am involved with something like that, I wouldn't really love the person. Sure, a friend, but not like, y'know, dating, stuff that boys and girls should do. But if it is anyone else, sure, I don't care. But I don't think they should be married.

I tried to understand that last sentence, so I'll try and give you an answer: I don't really want them to marry because it goes against the bible. It's kind of like on the Triscuit Crackers box, it shows the crackers, but with tomatoes, and stuff on them. It says "serving suggestion". You don't have to eat them like that. It's a suggestion. That's what I am saying. They don't have to not get married, it's just my opinion.

Don't kill me for saying it, it is my opinion, and it is why I'm atheist, THE BIBLE IS MADE-UP BULLSHIT! I hate how people read a stupid book with fictional events that somebody made up, follow it like they would get shot if they didn't! It's like me pulling out a novel from a bookstore and seeing that the main cahracter wants to go out to sea and become a fisherman, so I hurry to find my boat. Nobody is going to come down from the heavens and lighting-bolt you for not following Matthew verse whatever line whatever.

Now, onto the subject:
If you don't care about it, why do you say they shouldn't marry? What is ONE reason, besides the fact that the stupid bible says it's wrong, that they should live together and not get married? If it's the "same thing," as not getting married, as all of the christians say, why can't they get married like they want to? They want to be legally bonded, and feel like they are the same as a normal married couple. You can't feel the same if you are restricted of the right to be the same.

Red.Falcon
05-03-2006, 11:39 PM
Don't kill me for saying it, it is my opinion, and it is why I'm atheist, THE BIBLE IS MADE-UP BULLSHIT! I hate how people read a stupid book with fictional events that somebody made up, follow it like they would get shot if they didn't! It's like me pulling out a novel from a bookstore and seeing that the main cahracter wants to go out to sea and become a fisherman, so I hurry to find my boat. Nobody is going to come down from the heavens and lighting-bolt you for not following Matthew verse whatever line whatever.

Now, onto the subject:
If you don't care about it, why do you say they shouldn't marry? What is ONE reason, besides the fact that the stupid bible says it's wrong, that they should live together and not get married? If it's the "same thing," as not getting married, as all of the christians say, why can't they get married like they want to? They want to be legally bonded, and feel like they are the same as a normal married couple. You can't feel the same if you are restricted of the right to be the same.
Okay, okay, so I believe what the Bible says, and what (I think is) the all-powerful almighty God says...you all don't have to. I'm not trying to force any of this onto you guys, I'm just saying what I'm believing. Now could we stop talking about what I said, and stick with the topic not including what I believe? Thanks...

!CeMAn
05-04-2006, 03:49 AM
Okay, okay, so I believe what the Bible says, and what (I think is) the all-powerful almighty God says...you all don't have to. I'm not trying to force any of this onto you guys, I'm just saying what I'm believing. Now could we stop talking about what I said, and stick with the topic not including what I believe? Thanks...
:biggrin: Welcome to the OD board, where everything you say can and will be used against you.

I was just wondering why the Bible says men and women HAVE TO get married otherwise they're living in sin, yet homosexuals are not allowed to marry. So is sin fine and dandy for homos? Sounds kind of like hate mongering, "We don't want no damn homosexuals in Heaven!"...

To make a side point, there are several countries(/states even i believe i heard) in the world that do allow gay marriage, and are supported by numerous priests. What kind of religion is that to base your beliefs on; one that cannot even acheive a unified concensus?

IT
05-04-2006, 02:32 PM
Don't kill me for saying it, it is my opinion, and it is why I'm atheist, THE BIBLE IS MADE-UP BULLSHIT! I hate how people read a stupid book with fictional events that somebody made up, follow it like they would get shot if they didn't! It's like me pulling out a novel from a bookstore and seeing that the main cahracter wants to go out to sea and become a fisherman, so I hurry to find my boat. Nobody is going to come down from the heavens and lighting-bolt you for not following Matthew verse whatever line whatever.

Out of subject, but extremely necessary:

I don't really care what your purpose by saying that was, but it was impolite, incorrect and unnecessary of you. Sure, it's your opinion, but have you ever considered thinking about the opinions and views of the other side of the discussion/argument has?

You hate how people read a stupid book -

The Bible teaches you everything, you can possibly imagine, about being a good person in manners and mind. It teaches you about self-disciple, politeness, respect and those are only some of the qualities you need to have and what the Bible teaches you.


-with fictional events -

How would you know if they were fictional? Did you build a secret time machine and travel back somewhat 2,000 years? I believe that most of the events that occur in the Bible are around 75% correct, because people, even if driven/advised by God itself, probably have added their own perspectives to the story and history is almost always written in the perspective of the winner.
There is no evidence that the events of the Bible ever happened, but neither is there evidence that they didn't happen.

-follow it like they would get shot if they didn't! -

No, people don't get shot because they don't follow the Bible, people get shot because they follow the Bible.

Loyal Arcanine
05-04-2006, 03:38 PM
That's pretty damn insensitive, seeing as how not everyone on this forum is heterosexual. Keep your mouth shut.
Others are being pretty insensitive in this thread too, seeing as how not everybody on this forum is atheist. *coughd2cough* So keep your mouth shut.

Matt
05-04-2006, 08:32 PM
I guess it was quite rash of me, and I apologize. I just needed to say that to someone, hoping that one person would actually see it from an atheist's perspective.

I'm not bashing the religion itself in this post, so don't tell me I am. Here it goes:

Some christians have thought some completely ridiculous [stuff] over the past [many, many] years. For example, the hardcore christians that will not use medicine because they believe that if some big life form that controls the universe likes them, he/she/it will save them. Go ahead and pray, but it won't do much for you physically except keep your spirits high and your mind at ease. By using antibiotics, on the other hand, one can actually scientifically prove that a substance is removing the ailment and healing the person. There is no greater being that can do that. And those who talk to god? It's most likely schitzofrenia, as there is nothing and nobody there to talk to that can get inside of our heads. It's scientifically, well, messy, and frankly, impossible.

IT, I agree with the morals of the bible, and the way they advise you to treat others (with respect and dignity, yada yada), but I can't say that it is just and fair to all men and women. While the morals may be good, the actions are justifiably unfair. Why is a book to decide how we should treat people? You christians, find it within yourselves to stop reading what the bible says and think, with your own words, not a book's words, how would you feel if I was in their situation.

And DON'T go and tell me, hey! If I was gay, I shouldn't deserve to be happy and breathing, because the bible (a book!) tells me I should treat these humans unfairly!

IT, I've found science fiction novels that are more scientifically just. A supreme being did not turn an evil man into a no-legged creature because he convinced a woman to eat an apple that would give her knowledge of everyhthing in the world. that just doesn't happen, never can and never will.

Dog of Hellsing
05-04-2006, 08:50 PM
I hate when people use the Bible as an excuse for their actions or their words. Like they can't stand up for themselves, but have to hide behind something or someone else...

Anyways, I don't care what anyone or anything says. Homos are people too and they deserve as much respect and all the rights as straight people do. I just can't understand why, if it isn't hurting anyone, other people should feel they have the right to decide who can and can't get married.

"Oh, Tod and Jeremy want to get married, but it would depriciate Heaven and the Bible and the world in general! Well not really, but we won't let them get married just because they're both men. Tee hee!"

Stupidstupidstupidstupid! *Growl.* Still, everyone IS entitled to their own opinion, no matter how cruel or thoughtless or baseless the opinion is.

Red.Falcon
05-04-2006, 09:28 PM
And DON'T go and tell me, hey! If I was gay, I shouldn't deserve to be happy and breathing, because the bible (a book!) tells me I should treat these humans unfairly!
The Bible only says that they shouldn't get married. Sure, they can love each other and all, and we shouldn't treat them differently, or unfairly. We should treat them like human beings, which they are.
And the Bible isn't just a book in my opinion, it's recorded history of God's Word. I'm not forcing anyone ot believe this, just saying what I believe.

I saw this thread a while back and I want to know if people opinons have chnaged or some new opinions that have risen(sp?) My question to you all is What are your opinions on homosexuals, you know gays, bis, lesbos, all of those catagories and any I forgot. I really want to hear what you people have to say, once someone has brought up their opinion I might pop in here and there and express what I feel and well err debate lol.
And in the thread starter, it says opinion, I am saying my opinion, so it's not wrong or right. There is no need to correct me for something that is not fact, but what I think.

RouteMaster
05-04-2006, 10:10 PM
It is interesting (and important) to hear it from an atheist's opinion, and you make your opinion crystal clear Defense.2.
As a Christian I should point out that the Bible is not considered "a Book" but the inspired Word of God. This is not a debate over Christianity or the Bible, they are indeed encompassed by the debate of Homosexuality but please don't be so personal in your arguement. As a member of a Debating Club I know getting personal and passionate can heat up a debate but when your arguement is based mainly on opinion it can work against you.

On the topics raised, it returns to the arguement of the seperation of State and Church. The Church should not impose its views and morals on what must be treated as a secular society and in return the State offers religious freedom. Therefore I do not believe that it is the responsibility of the government to decide if this is illegal or legal. Politicans can be put in a very difficult position. This issue should be sent to the courtroom where it can be argued without bias (intentional or not). Courts are not perfect, but in a democracy they are the greatest weapon a citizen possesses.

!CeMAn
05-04-2006, 10:50 PM
~*Apologies for the off topic rants in advance*~

There is no evidence that the events of the Bible ever happened, but neither is there evidence that they didn't happen.


Most of the Old Testament is based on actual events from history, such as the great flood. The New Testament is based on Jesus' life, and yes, there are historical records that prove a man named Jesus was crucified for claiming to be King of the Jews. Both testaments, however, have been embellished by man and men claiming to be under the influence of God himself. Not only that, but the stories have no doubt been corrupted over the centuries like a game of Chinese Whisper.

And, D.2, The Garden of Eden story was made up to try and understand(quite poorly, but whatever) where man got the shame to start wearing clothes. We were once naked apes running around, yet somewhere it became necessary to cover those naughty bits. Why? Geez, who knows, maybe man found a weird hallucinogenic plant that tripped him out and gave it to the rest of his group and before they knew it they were afraid to show their penises to eachother. It's just stories and theories written hundreds of centuries ago. Just keep in mind that dozens of cultures around the world have similar stories they pass down. From Native Indians to Romans, to the Greeks, to Europe, to the Middle East, there are all stories of the son of God, great floods, a time of paradise and giant sea creatures swallowing dudes. I think you're too naive to claim Athiest...

Back on topic: Yay fo homos!

Matt
05-05-2006, 12:24 AM
Homos are people too and they deserve as much respect and all the rights as straight people do.
You can start by not calling them homos...

EDIT: Icy, naivete has nothing to do with what I believe. Sure I may be stubborn in my ideas and don't know the whole story, but that doesn't mean I support the idea of God, or even organized religion for that matter. I'm pretty sure I can call myself atheist.

!CeMAn
05-05-2006, 02:12 AM
I don't mean to attack your "beliefs"; Don't read it that way. I only used the word naive because i don't quite understand your rationale behind being an Atheist. Unfortunately, it's a discussion for another place.

To clear the air: Saying "homo" isn't meant to be any kind of slur. It's merely a nickname, abbreiviation. I'm speaking for myself, and i'm confident i can speak for TyT aswell.

IT
05-05-2006, 09:19 PM
I don't mean to attack your "beliefs"; Don't read it that way. I only used the word naive because i don't quite understand your rationale behind being an Atheist. Unfortunately, it's a discussion for another place.

To clear the air: Saying "homo" isn't meant to be any kind of slur. It's merely a nickname, abbreiviation. I'm speaking for myself, and i'm confident i can speak for TyT aswell.

Ice, you can't attack an atheist's beliefs, because atheists do not believe in anything. If they do believe in something, it's themselves that they believe in.

As for the topic, in my opinion, homosexuals are okay to have around, just not too up close. I dislike seeing two men in sexual contact, but that may be just me. I have nothing against them, but I do not favor them.

Seven
05-05-2006, 09:30 PM
Ice, you can't attack an atheist's beliefs, because atheists do not believe in anything. If they do believe in something, it's themselves that they believe in.


Atheists do have beliefs, they just don't believe in higher beings and whatever. They can easily believe in morality and society and the human capacities though.


As for the topic, in my opinion, homosexuals are okay to have around, just not too up close. I dislike seeing two men in sexual contact, but that may be just me. I have nothing against them, but I do not favor them.


Lol, two women on the other hand...:rolleyes:

Dog of Hellsing
05-07-2006, 07:16 PM
To clear the air: Saying "homo" isn't meant to be any kind of slur. It's merely a nickname, abbreiviation. I'm speaking for myself, and i'm confident i can speak for TyT aswell.

Exactly. It's kind of how you can say "*****" without meaning disrespect. *Shrug.* I'm just tired of typing out "homosexual" all the time.

JohtoTrainer
05-07-2006, 07:45 PM
Exactly. It's kind of how you can say "*****" without meaning disrespect. *Shrug.* I'm just tired of typing out "homosexual" all the time.

You walk up to a black guy and say "*****." And see how they feel about it...:rolleyes:

!CeMAn
05-08-2006, 05:49 AM
You walk up to a black guy and say "*****." And see how they feel about it...:rolleyes:
You know what she means :rolleyes:.

Dog of Hellsing
05-08-2006, 07:19 PM
Thank you !Ce. JohtoTrainer, quit trying to twist around people's words. I didn't say I'm going to go calling every black person I see "*****." I was saying you can say it without meaning insult or meaning insult, just like you can say "homo" with or without meaning to cause someone emotional pain or unease. *Shakes head.* Stop acting like a n00b.

Anyways, this is about people's views on homosexuality, not on what you can or can't call someone. And I think everyone here knows clearly where I stand on the subject.

Seven
05-08-2006, 09:53 PM
Anyways, this is about people's views on homosexuality, not on what you can or can't call someone. And I think everyone here knows clearly where I stand on the subject.

Amen to that, this thread isn't for semantic games, and btw, homo is the dutch word for gay :P Like, the completley acceptable word.

Sudo
05-08-2006, 09:58 PM
If it was "unnatural" then why do some people naturally feel attracted to the same sex..?

Red.Falcon
05-09-2006, 11:29 AM
If it was "unnatural" then why do some people naturally feel attracted to the same sex..?
......I guess we just use the word "natural" wrong. Like, when we say "Why did you do that? I HATE YOU!", we don't acually mean "hate" like, "hope you burn in Hell for all eternity".

LS
05-09-2006, 12:06 PM
If it was "unnatural" then why do some people naturally feel attracted to the same sex..?


maybe because they dont like the other sex its there life they can do what ever they want but as a muslim its a very bad sin for me.

Dog of Hellsing
05-09-2006, 06:54 PM
its there life they can do what ever they want

Amen to that. Why can't people understand this very simple concept? In the Wiccan Rede (Or Rede of the Wicca as it's sometimes called) it says:

"Live and let live,
Fairly take and fairly give...
...Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill,
If It Harm None, Do What Ye Will."

^ Seriously, what's so hard about this to understand? I don't get it. If something you or someone else is doing isn't harming anyone, why should anyone care if you do it, you know?

Finch
05-09-2006, 07:02 PM
Amen to that. Why can't people understand this very simple concept? In the Wiccan Rede (Or Rede of the Wicca as it's sometimes called) it says:

"Live and let live,
Fairly take and fairly give...
...Eight words the Wiccan Rede fulfill,
If It Harm None, Do What Ye Will."

^ Seriously, what's so hard about this to understand? I don't get it. If something you or someone else is doing isn't harming anyone, why should anyone care if you do it, you know?
Well, people do. Society generally rejects people believed to be "abnormal" because of irrational fear. Fear of what is barely ever apparent. Whatever, though.

No, I'm not gay, just educated.

Dog of Hellsing
05-09-2006, 07:05 PM
I know people tend to hate and/or fear things that are different or abnormal. The thing I'm asking is why? You're right, because most times it's completely irrational. *Sighs.* Just one of the prices humans pay for being so smart and intelligent, I guess.

Sixto
05-17-2006, 08:34 PM
I have no problems with them, my best friend is gay, and she's just like one of the guys. I don't see her as anyone different, or anyobdy else who chooses to be gay. Cause that's what is it, their decision.

Orthar
05-17-2006, 11:06 PM
I have no problems with them, my best friend is gay, and she's just like one of the guys. I don't see her as anyone different, or anyobdy else who chooses to be gay. Cause that's what is it, their decision.
Amen to TT's and Mario's statment. Both are true and both I agree with.

Alonso
05-22-2006, 09:48 PM
the Civil War started with the mistreament of African-Americans
False! but I see your point with the other two examples so good way to put it.

I have nothing against homosexuals and I guess they do deserve the same rights as other people but people COME ON you guys don't see the logic. A human has one purpose and one purpose only; To Reproduce. Now how are we suppose to reproduce when we have gay couples and marriages? That is why homosexuality is wrong. It makes sense too. A man's pen(s fits in a woman's vag)na to REPRODUCE. If [hypothetically]suddenly everybody on the planet were homosexuals the human race would end. As simple as that. We don't need religion to interfere with common sense. I am not saying that we should kill all the homos out there. It's just that homosexuality should not exist to begin with. Animals that have homosexual behavior have nothing to do with this. Just because some do have homosexual behaviors doesn't mean that all of them do.

I bet someone is gonna refute me with some stupid example of some politician.

Matt
05-22-2006, 09:59 PM
I...will...stay...calm...

I have done a LOT of bashing in this thread, and you, Charizard, are why. I hate to break it to you, but it does exist. And if you are honestly saying that a human's purpose NOW is still only to reproduce, you are missing out on life.

I have suspected this for quite some time, but wanted to wait for confirmation before saying it: My twin sister is gay. I have grown up with this girl for my entire life. Being twins, we ALWAYS did things together. I feel like she is part of me. Now, when she grows up, there is NO DOUBT I want her to be happy. This obviously means she gets married and lives with the one she loves. If this subject is not addressed, you have ME to face. I am sure by the time I get married, she will already be. So if you are going to say homosexuals do not belong on this earth, **** YOU!

Alonso
05-22-2006, 10:19 PM
I...will...stay...calm...

I have done a LOT of bashing in this thread, and you, Charizard, are why. I hate to break it to you, but it does exist. And if you are honestly saying that a human's purpose NOW is still only to reproduce, you are missing out on life.

I have suspected this for quite some time, but wanted to wait for confirmation before saying it: My twin sister is gay. I have grown up with this girl for my entire life. Being twins, we ALWAYS did things together. I feel like she is part of me. Now, when she grows up, there is NO DOUBT I want her to be happy. This obviously means she gets married and lives with the one she loves. If this subject is not addressed, you have ME to face. I am sure by the time I get married, she will already be. So if you are going to say homosexuals do not belong on this earth, **** YOU!
I said it SHOULDN'T exist not that it DOESN'T. Secondly, that is the purpose of humans, to reproduce. However, we humans are different to the animal that lives through instinct. We wanted more. Thirdly, you have refuted with some stupid example (DISCLAIMER: Your sister isn't stupid). Common Sense! A man's pen(s fits in a woman's vag)na.

Matt
05-22-2006, 10:25 PM
You have the nerve to say that my sister being gay and me wanting her to be happy is a STUPID EXAMPLE? I would kill you and go to jail for it if it meant you wouldn't say anything like that again.

Humans have evolved mentally in a sense that they thrive for more. Humans ultimately want to be the best, as well as live life with as much fun and happiness as possible in a short 80 years.

Thirdly, Diversity is nothing to be ashamed of, and should exist. It helps show people the meaning of kindness and acceptance. ACCEPTANCE! Accept the fact that some people care for the same gender, it doesn't affect your stupid ass at all. So do NOT tell me it should not exist, because that is ultimately telling me my sister, my best friend in life should never have been born.

EDIT: Buy it and shut up: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/0786885475/002-5396629-4421655?v=glance&n=283155

Incongruity
05-22-2006, 11:24 PM
A man's ***** fits into a woman's ******. Then again, a knife also fits into an electrical conduit. Hmm. I wonder?

Not saying that going through sexual intercourse is as painful as receiving a few hundred volts of electricity, but just an example of how "____ fits with _____" can be stupid. Want a more mature example? Well, look at dogs. Domesticated canines are ALL the same species. Yet there are German Sheperds, and there are Chihuahuas. Technically, they CAN mate, but they don't necessarily FIT together. Just because the ***** doesn't fit with the ******, does that mean they don't belong together? Oh, I presume that you don't think that there should be interracial sex, and that you disdain those Hispanic mongrels as well.

Oh, and it's absolutely impossible to deny that homosexuality in some sort is absolutely natural. I don't think it was this thread, but I believe I cited something on how rams go through full anal penetration with other rams? Oh, and even if we're not focusing on animals, there are countless asexual organisms, including organisms with no sexual differentiation whatsoever. Oh, and look at the highly evolved plants, and count how many hermaphrodites there are. All bypass what we perceive as natural sexual laws, but they're doing fine.

That said, we can't hyperbolize how natural homosexuality is. In reality, homosexuality alone is undoubtedly an evolutionary disadvantage (for humans). Now, let's think about this for a second. Why do humans and bacteria own? They own for the same reason, but go about it in different ways. They both own because of a varied gene pool. Bacteria: they multiply so rapidly that mutations are occurring extremely rapidly, since entire generations are born and wiped out in a short amount of time. With all the mutations, there is infinite variation, thus safety against almost any natural threat. Why do humans own? Well obviously, they reproduce much slower, but humans have genetic variation for a different reason. They, along with several other types of animals, undergo meiosis, which allows for genetic variation. Humans go through sexual reproduction. That is their only way to create progeny. They can't exactly create a clone of themelves like a Hydra, or just split into two like a bacteria. No, humans actually have to combine DNA with one another. Two guys cannot combine their DNA and create a new human being. Essentially, if you're purely homosexual and not bi, your DNA dies with you.

Females, on the other hand, are VERY different. I may have explaiend this to SF, Ierdar, and a few others, but there's this natural phenomenon called parthenogenesis. Essentially, DNA from a somatic cell is put into a female egg gamete (which has had its n DNA removed). Because it has 2n DNA, it believes it has been fertilized, and it begins to incubate in a normal way. Theoretically, if we could splice DNA together perfectly, (and then bring about this process flawlessly) males would not be necessary. We would have the genetic variation that makes us us, as well as the combination of DNA without a male donor. Of course, it's all just theory (for most organisms other than insects)... that is, until the Elders of the Amazon Caliphate initiate the final solution to wipe out the male sex in its entirety. But the point is, gay males are evolutionary disadvantaged, but lesbian females... have potential to bypass their limitations.

Matt
05-22-2006, 11:28 PM
Every day, You lead me more and more to question how such a young man is so wise, sk.

I also need to give you a hug.

!CeMAn
05-23-2006, 01:04 AM
You know, i've said before, i think homosexuality is likely nature's way of controlling our explosive population; the gay community has been given the privllige of not being here to reproduce, but to mate for the sheer pleasure of it. I know i'd enjoy #$%ing a little more if i knew there was no danger of conception...

Shadow Charizard, you owe me 1 Canadian dollar for that reckless use of [!'s] in your posts. Just click the symbol at the bottom of my sig, muppet.

Dog of Hellsing
05-23-2006, 07:23 PM
A human has one purpose and one purpose only; To Reproduce.

Dude, WTF? How can a living creature's only purpose be to reproduce? Do you really belive that? If so, then you need to get out more often and live a little.

Now how are we suppose to reproduce when we have gay couples and marriages? That is why homosexuality is wrong.

Oo Just because someone else is gay or whatever, how does that effect OUR (straight people) ability to reproduce? Are the gay and lesbian couples holding guns to our heads? If so then I must be DAMNED ignorant of that handgun muzzle or something.

It makes sense too. A man's pen!s fits in a woman's vag!na to REPRODUCE.

Oo So how do you explain sex for nothing more than pleasure or business, if sex is only for reproducing? You know that this comment is absolutely retarded and holds no merit, right?

If [hypothetically]suddenly everybody on the planet were homosexuals the human race would end.

Again...WTF? Just because there are homos in the world doesn't mean BAM everyone's going to be one. Where are you cominf up with these impossible "What ifs?" I think you're just saying this crap to drive home a point that doesn't really exist except in your own mind.

As simple as that. We don't need religion to interfere with common sense.

Common sense about what? That you're acting like a complete n00b?

I am not saying that we should kill all the homos out there. It's just that homosexuality should not exist to begin with.

And why not? It does, so ****ing deal with it, okay? If it shouldn't exist it would be a paradox since it does, and paradoxes can't exist. Therefore, sice homosexuality DOES exist, that means that it must be meant to exist. If you can't understand this simple logic, then oh well.

Animals that have homosexual behavior have nothing to do with this.

Uh, hello, are you forgetting that humans are animals as well?

Just because some do have homosexual behaviors doesn't mean that all of them do.

Yet you're afraid that all humans are suddenly going to turn homo, going by your statement earlier about how if all humans go gay, the human race will go extinct.

I bet someone is gonna refute me with some stupid example of some politician.

Guess what, you're finally right about something! Except for the politician part.

People like you just make me want to scream. Try if you can to argue with the points I've made.

theEND
05-23-2006, 07:37 PM
People like you just make me want to scream. Try if you can to argue with the points I've made.
Yeah. Homosexuality is something referred as a crime. You have these 2 girls who like each other. The next thing you know, they're bathing in the same tub. Homosexuality isn't always caused by the people doing it. Sometimes people are forced to do it because of threats.

1. Rapists threatening to kill you unless you have s3x with another person.
2. You're a homosexualist in some kind of movie or magazine.
3. Your friend wants you to.

Seawolf
05-23-2006, 08:42 PM
Yeah. Homosexuality is something referred as a crime. You have these 2 girls who like each other. The next thing you know, they're bathing in the same tub. Homosexuality isn't always caused by the people doing it. Sometimes people are forced to do it because of threats.

1. Rapists threatening to kill you unless you have s3x with another person.
2. You're a homosexualist in some kind of movie or magazine.
3. Your friend wants you to.

What the hell? Are you saying that homosexuality is only appropiate when you're forced into it?

Go away, please.

Shadow Charizard, I am now convinced you are retarded.

Sudo
05-23-2006, 08:48 PM
I know a gay.

Heh, she's cool and she's not a butch rugby player or a porn star, like most people imagine. xD

Seven
05-23-2006, 08:49 PM
I wonder if SC defines himself by the number of children he brings forth...

Dog of Hellsing
05-23-2006, 11:45 PM
I wonder if SC defines himself by the number of children he brings forth...

Most likely :susp:...

And CP...WTF? Dude, if you have to play a part like that in a movie and don't want to, they can get a double for you or something. And I don't know of any terrorist that wants two people of the same sex to get it on. Mostly they just want to kill people and cause fear and chaos, and that doesn't usually happen by two women banging, forgive the term. And if a girl friend of mine wanted me to get freaky with her, I'd just straight up say, "You know I'm not like that, so no, sorry, I can't do that."

theEND
05-24-2006, 12:10 AM
Most likely :susp:...

And CP...WTF? Dude, if you have to play a part like that in a movie and don't want to, they can get a double for you or something. And I don't know of any terrorist that wants two people of the same sex to get it on. Mostly they just want to kill people and cause fear and chaos, and that doesn't usually happen by two women banging, forgive the term. And if a girl friend of mine wanted me to get freaky with her, I'd just straight up say, "You know I'm not like that, so no, sorry, I can't do that."
I'm not saying it is ok. I'm saying that in the world homosexuality is something people must do or want to do. I hate it and I don't like it. Don't get me wrong. And I really don't want that from you, TT. :cry:

Matt
05-24-2006, 12:13 AM
There is no must do, it is only want to do, as it is for heterosexuals.

Telling a homosexual that they should be in love with the opposite sex is like telling you you should be in love with the same sex. It's the way their brain is constructed at birth, they have no choice. So don't say you hate it.

Dog of Hellsing
05-24-2006, 12:14 AM
I'm not saying it is ok. I'm saying that in the world homosexuality is something people must do or want to do. I hate it and I don't like it. Don't get me wrong. And I really don't want that from you, TT. :cry:

I think you've misunderstood my post...

Are you saying you're for or against homosexuality? I'm assuming you're against it, since you said you hate it. I was just trying to tell you that you can't really be forced into being a homo. It's a choice.

EDIT: Hear hear D.2! I agree completely.

Red.Falcon
05-24-2006, 12:41 AM
There is no must do, it is only want to do, as it is for heterosexuals.

Telling a homosexual that they should be in love with the opposite sex is like telling you you should be in love with the same sex. It's the way their brain is constructed at birth, they have no choice. So don't say you hate it.
Wow. I totally agree. Now that I think about it....Yeah. Pretend none of my posts existed int his thread but this one. :crackup:

And CP.....I doubt alot of homosexuals are being forced to...

Alonso
05-24-2006, 02:02 AM
*Defeated*

Finglonger
05-24-2006, 02:11 AM
Yeah. Homosexuality is something referred as a crime. You have these 2 girls who like each other. The next thing you know, they're bathing in the same tub. Homosexuality isn't always caused by the people doing it. Sometimes people are forced to do it because of threats.

1. Rapists threatening to kill you unless you have s3x with another person.
2. You're a homosexualist in some kind of movie or magazine.
3. Your friend wants you to.

Do you even understand what you are saying? Please go die, do humanity a favor, we dont need any more ignorant bigots

and I must say that d2 hit the nail on the head

Matt
05-24-2006, 02:13 AM
I always do.

MystiKal
05-24-2006, 02:17 AM
What's so wrong with being a lesbian?

:]

!CeMAn
06-01-2006, 01:34 AM
What's so wrong with being a lesbian?

:]
Absolutely nothing, VT, absolutely nothing. That's what we're trying to nail in this thread.
Excuse that delicious pun.

Silver Dragonair
06-01-2006, 09:49 PM
I dont have problems with gay people. But latley I've been starting to hate them, like a lot of them look at me. Then talk about how good I look and stuff, it makes me feel uneasy. Like they stare at me and lick their lips.

I hate it. To be honest I really dont like homosexuals. But thats me, if Im straight why would I like them??? I have no problems if they keep away from me, because its not doing anything to me. But when they say things and look at me wierd. Is where I have really had enough of the uprise in homosexuals. Especially when you hear things like "Oh hes so fine, I just wanna (insert sexual explicit action here)"

:eek: :eek:

Thats where the line is crossed. So yeah, Im better off without them.

Matt
06-01-2006, 09:54 PM
I dont have problems with gay people. But latley I've been starting to hate them, like a lot of them look at me. Then talk about how good I look and stuff, it makes me feel uneasy. Like they stare at me and lick their lips.

I hate it. To be honest I really dont like homosexuals. But thats me, if Im straight why would I like them??? I have no problems if they keep away from me, because its not doing anything to me. But when they say things and look at me wierd. Is where I have really had enough of the uprise in homosexuals. Especially when you hear things like "Oh hes so fine, I just wanna (insert sexual explicit action here)"

:eek: :eek:

Thats where the line is crossed. So yeah, Im better off without them.
Not all homosexuals are jerks like that. I sure as hell don't do that to any girls I know or see. That is rude and obnoxious. Similarly, most homosexuals keep to themselves.

!CeMAn
06-02-2006, 01:42 AM
I dont have problems with gay people. But latley I've been starting to hate them, like a lot of them look at me. Then talk about how good I look and stuff, it makes me feel uneasy. Like they stare at me and lick their lips.

I hate it. To be honest I really dont like homosexuals. But thats me, if Im straight why would I like them??? I have no problems if they keep away from me, because its not doing anything to me. But when they say things and look at me wierd. Is where I have really had enough of the uprise in homosexuals. Especially when you hear things like "Oh hes so fine, I just wanna (insert sexual explicit action here)"

:eek: :eek:

Thats where the line is crossed. So yeah, Im better off without them.
Hard News Flash = That's not homosexuals, that's people. Gay or straight, you're going to find people who make obnoxious comments like that.

Dog of Hellsing
06-03-2006, 04:08 PM
Hard News Flash = That's not homosexuals, that's people. Gay or straight, you're going to find people who make obnoxious comments like that.

Amen to that. I've never once met a homo (or come across one when I've been out and about) who's said things like that to someone. And trust me, I know where I live there are quite a few homos. For some reason, I don't really buy what you're saying SD. It seems to me you're just saying this so you can have a reason to say, "I don't like homos, I feel we'd all be better off without them," and not feel guilty doing it. Then again, maybe you're telling the truth...

Khashoggi
06-07-2006, 10:24 PM
Uh, whether or not he's telling the truth is completely irrelevant, because, as !ce basically said, straight people do that too. Plenty of women and men are subject to inappropriate comments like that.

I don't like the way that some people are basically talking rubbish in an attempt to glorify homosexuality, like stuff that pretty much says "gay people are nicer than straight people", and TT implying that gay people never harass people. What is your evidence for this, hmm? Clearly some do, just like some straight people do. Do you want us to think of homosexuals on the same level as heterosexuals? Because jumping ahead and trying to raise their status higher than that of straight people is just as wrong as considering straight people as superior to gays. And it's bull.

Loyal Arcanine
06-07-2006, 10:40 PM
Uh, whether or not he's telling the truth is completely irrelevant, because, as !ce basically said, straight people do that too. Plenty of women and men are subject to inappropriate comments like that.

I don't like the way that some people are basically talking rubbish in an attempt to glorify homosexuality, like stuff that pretty much says "gay people are nicer than straight people", and TT implying that gay people never harass people. What is your evidence for this, hmm? Clearly some do, just like some straight people do. Do you want us to think of homosexuals on the same level as heterosexuals? Because jumping ahead and trying to raise their status higher than that of straight people is just as wrong as considering straight people as superior to gays. And it's bull.
You took the words out of my mouth.

Well not really, since I wanted to say this earlier but failed to find the right words, with my crap English.

Dog of Hellsing
06-08-2006, 08:43 PM
Hmmm, let's see. I never said homos don't harass people, thank you. I said I've yet to see it happen. Everyone at one point or another harasses others whether they mean to or not, though usually it's intentional.

And let me clarify: It seems to me that the gay people I've met are nicer than straight people. I'm not saying that for sure all gays are nicer, because of course they all aren't.

Anyways, I'd like it if you'd quit trying to twist my words and such. Just because I'm giving my views and taking up for the gays is no reason to say I'm glorifying them. I also find it offensive that you said I'm trying to imply things when I'm not. If you can find proof that I've implied gays never harass, then show it to me. And don't try to quote from my last post, because there's no implication there.

Khashoggi
06-08-2006, 09:11 PM
Hmmm, let's see. I never said homos don't harass people, thank you. I said I've yet to see it happen. Everyone at one point or another harasses others whether they mean to or not, though usually it's intentional.

And let me clarify: It seems to me that the gay people I've met are nicer than straight people. I'm not saying that for sure all gays are nicer, because of course they all aren't.

Anyways, I'd like it if you'd quit trying to twist my words and such. Just because I'm giving my views and taking up for the gays is no reason to say I'm glorifying them. I also find it offensive that you said I'm trying to imply things when I'm not. If you can find proof that I've implied gays never harass, then show it to me. And don't try to quote from my last post, because there's no implication there.
You cannot use your own few experiences to justify your argument. I do not believe that comments such as "all the gays I've met are nice" or "I've never seen a gay harass someone" have any place in this debate whatsoever. There are many things that I have observed in my own short lifetime which I could easily draw incorrect conclusions from, but only fact can provide you with a substantial argument.

I have nothing against homosexuals, incidentally, and I personally see no reason to, unless you're someone whose reflex reaction is "eww, that's just wrong/unnatural" "dicks should go in here, not here!", which seem pretty poor excuses for homophobia, as what they both come down to is closed minds and usually religious influence.

!CeMAn
06-09-2006, 11:38 PM
I love gay people.

Seven
06-10-2006, 09:33 AM
I love gay people.

I love people.

I kinda get the feeling some people think of gays as a seperate group ni society, I strongly oppose that view. Gay support groups only exist for the common goal of creating acceptance and equal rights. It's not because "they"are different, in any form or way, and thus form smoe sort of unique breed of humans. It's like...we're all humans, some of us like carrots, others lettuce, and some of us like the same sex, and others the other sex. It's so little of a deal I don't even vaguely understand what the fuss is all about.

!CeMAn
06-10-2006, 05:16 PM
I love people.

I kinda get the feeling some people think of gays as a seperate group ni society, I strongly oppose that view. Gay support groups only exist for the common goal of creating acceptance and equal rights. It's not because "they"are different, in any form or way, and thus form smoe sort of unique breed of humans. It's like...we're all humans, some of us like carrots, others lettuce, and some of us like the same sex, and others the other sex. It's so little of a deal I don't even vaguely understand what the fuss is all about.
Why stop there? Every person is an animal, right? Let's not call ourselves people, because THAT would be putting all animals in categories. Which is wrong.
Why discriminate? Let's just refer to all life as one thing: organsim.

Yeah that won't get confusing. I understand your point, 7, but the fact is categories are necessary in some situations. If i say i love people, the response will be "Good for you.". If i specify gay people my message is clear.

Another thing, EVERYBODY falls into a group. There are gays, metalheads, scientists, nazis, preppies, athletes, criminals, obese, slutty, those who love Star Trek, etc. There's nothing wrong with this. It goes back to first humans who travelled in tribes. We cluster eachother to distinguish boundaries or association. Intentionally or not, it's a natural reaction and part of our species.

Like i said, i understand the point. Just don't feel wrong about grouping homosexuals; It's not necessarily terrible.

Ierdar
06-10-2006, 06:23 PM
Actually, saying you love gay people, though it's not negative, implies prejudice on your part. :wink:

Seven
06-10-2006, 06:33 PM
Why stop there? Every person is an animal, right? Let's not call ourselves people, because THAT would be putting all animals in categories. Which is wrong.
Why discriminate? Let's just refer to all life as one thing: organsim.

Yeah that won't get confusing. I understand your point, 7, but the fact is categories are necessary in some situations. If i say i love people, the response will be "Good for you.". If i specify gay people my message is clear.

Another thing, EVERYBODY falls into a group. There are gays, metalheads, scientists, nazis, preppies, athletes, criminals, obese, slutty, those who love Star Trek, etc. There's nothing wrong with this. It goes back to first humans who travelled in tribes. We cluster eachother to distinguish boundaries or association. Intentionally or not, it's a natural reaction and part of our species.

Like i said, i understand the point. Just don't feel wrong about grouping homosexuals; It's not necessarily terrible.


I wasn't referring to you actually though it did seem that way :P. You're too hawt to argue with for this lesbian ;o.

I know that you're right about groups being necessary, l was trying to make like...an ideological point.

Houndoom
06-10-2006, 07:41 PM
I hate gay men. Not lesbian girls, gay men.

You asked for my opinion right?

!CeMAn
06-11-2006, 09:25 PM
I wasn't referring to you actually though it did seem that way :P. You're too hawt to argue with for this lesbian ;o.

I know that you're right about groups being necessary, l was trying to make like...an ideological point.
I know, GF.
I thought it wouldn't be a bad idea to post it anyways. Seemed worth saying.
:wink:

Dog of Hellsing
06-12-2006, 08:34 PM
Khashoggi: Meh, whatever. I'm just saying that homos have rights too and all. They aren't different from others, even though everyone thinks they are. Anyways, this is our beliefs and views on gay people, so my comments have validity, thank you. This whole debate is pretty much drawing on our own personal experiences, in case you didn't realize that. Otherwise we couldn't have a debate :susp:.

And Houndoom, why do you hate gay men? Have they commited some God-awful crime against you? I hate people like you. "Oh, gay women are okay but gay men are abominations against nature!" Just go away. I realize this is our views and all, but you're being pretty close-minded.

And just so you know, there's no difference between gay men and gay women really, so I don't see why you hate gay men. Apparently it's okay for two women to have sex but not two men. Why is that? *Shakes head.*

Red.Falcon
06-12-2006, 09:20 PM
I hate gay men. Not lesbian girls, gay men.

You asked for my opinion right?
Yeah, we did, but we never said we wouldn't criticize it.

I said before that I think marrage should exist solely between a man and a woman *Dodges bullets* but not two men or two women. Sure, they can love each other, but I think marrage is too much.

Unless you are some perverted 40 year old typing away on your computer whilst munching on puffy Cheetos while your parents yelling at you to get your unwashed clothes out of the way of the doorway to the basement, I see no reason you should hate only gay men. Or only hate gay people. Or just only hate people.

Now, Houndoom, go make a thread on how you almost got a girl from MySpace to talk to you, and don't post any more of that crap here.

Okay, I'm done.

!CeMAn
06-12-2006, 10:56 PM
Apparently it's okay for two women to have sex but not two men. Why is that? *Shakes head.*

I think you know the answer to that... We're pigs.

I'll admit the double standard here isn't very healthy, but you've got to understand a man. They are visually stimulated first of all. They enjoy looking at naked women. They enjoy looking at two naked women twice as much. Most men are also quite partial to watching people have sex. When you replace the man in the sex with a second woman, it's like adding icing on a cake; makes a good thing better. Not to mention the whole fantasy aspect of two women at one time...

Besides, we're pigs.

Dog of Hellsing
06-12-2006, 11:06 PM
Remind me never to take a trip inside your head XD.

Seriously though, I'm not talking about entertainment or anything like that. I'm talking about it being acceptable. There are lots of women who think two women banging is okay but two men going at it is just gross and shouldn't be legal or whatever.

I don't think it's right for someone to say: "This kind of homosexuality is okay, great even, but this kind is disgusting and should be made illegal!" It's kind of defeating the purpose of saying that you dislike/hate/whatever homos.

Khashoggi
06-13-2006, 09:39 PM
[COLOR="Teal"]Khashoggi: Meh, whatever. I'm just saying that homos have rights too and all. They aren't different from others, even though everyone thinks they are. Anyways, this is our beliefs and views on gay people, so my comments have validity, thank you. This whole debate is pretty much drawing on our own personal experiences, in case you didn't realize that. Otherwise we couldn't have a debate :susp:.[COLOR]
If they aren't any different, don't portray them more positively than straight people. And from MY experience, homophobes form the minority of people I've met. So quit talking like you're the only reasonable human being on the planet.

There are double standards everywhere, and !ce is right, men are pigs. It tends to be mostly men that dislike gay men while condoning lesbian porn. Oh, and also, that's not lesbianism in general. There are quite a few people who like to watch girl-on-girl action but they aren't so open to the idea of a genuine relationship between women, and will call people lesbians to offend. There is also discrimination by women against lesbians, and then there's discrimination by gays against bisexuals... and of course straights on occasion, but that's certainly not as much of an issue as homophobia. Discrimination is not exclusively directed at gays (or gay men).

~* Esper *~
06-15-2006, 05:25 PM
I believe that a lot of discrimination comes from younger generations. In my group of friends, there's a gay guy. He tells us horror stories about how he gets beat up and spit at in school.

On the contrary .....

I have a lot of older friends too, but they don't seem to have a problem with any gay guys. It might be because of exposure. I live in New Orleans, so when you grow up you get nothing but exposure.

It's my experience that a lot of homophobs are from small towns and it's seems to be a lot of rednecks, like those KKK members on Jerry Springer. Those kind of people just show their immaturity and they make themselves look stupid ......

!CeMAn
06-16-2006, 12:53 AM
I believe that a lot of discrimination comes from younger generations. In my group of friends, there's a gay guy. He tells us horror stories about how he gets beat up and spit at in school.

On the contrary .....

I have a lot of older friends too, but they don't seem to have a problem with any gay guys. It might be because of exposure. I live in New Orleans, so when you grow up you get nothing but exposure.

It's my experience that a lot of homophobs are from small towns and it's seems to be a lot of rednecks, like those KKK members on Jerry Springer. Those kind of people just show their immaturity and they make themselves look stupid ......

I know when i was a kid, we all had some pretty brutal things to say about homos. As you get older, you stop basing your judgements on what all the "cool kids" tell you. Pretty much, when your peers start pretending to be gay, or flashing eachother their junk in order to get a laugh, that's when you know it's ok to not hate on gays.
Not that imitating homos is funny :silenced:...

Orthar
06-26-2006, 11:30 AM
I know when i was a kid, we all had some pretty brutal things to say about homos. As you get older, you stop basing your judgements on what all the "cool kids" tell you. Pretty much, when your peers start pretending to be gay, or flashing eachother their junk in order to get a laugh, that's when you know it's ok to not hate on gays.
Not that imitating homos is funny :silenced:...
Yeah I belive that too. With age we gain wisdom and knowledge.

cichlid_keeper
06-27-2006, 12:57 AM
my dad is gay. so im not a homofobe

Dog of Hellsing
06-27-2006, 07:01 PM
:clap:

Heh, wow, someone who has a homosexual parent and is willing to admit it. Especially here...you go dude!

And yeah, I agree with !Ce as well. Though I was raised in a neighborhood with gays, and my Mom isn't homophobic, so I never really got into the whole "I hate gays whoo" thing to begin with. You do have a point though.

Ham and Cheese
06-27-2006, 07:16 PM
Personally, I've got no problems with gays. They're people, just like the blacks, whites, Christians, Jews, straights, etc.

But America as a whole doesn't seem to understand that.

Seawolf
06-27-2006, 07:20 PM
But America as a whole doesn't seem to understand that.

*coughBiblethumperscough*

What?

Kabuki
06-27-2006, 07:20 PM
Yay for Homosexuals. I am Homosexual. You know Virgina wants to make it ok for people to discriminate because of gayness, so Houndoom go live there you'll fit it. I think its easier for Girls to like gay men because they can relate to them better. I think it is funny when men look at lisbean porn them go bash gay men. The Food Network had a gay couple on Food 911. It was cool.

Hidden_Mist
06-27-2006, 10:00 PM
Hey Kabuki...I give you a high-five for admitting your homosexuality!! I think it is wrong that people can just sit there and say that marriage should be only between a man and woman. Everyone is a living breatihng person and that is cruel. Everyone has rights!!!

Orthar
06-27-2006, 10:08 PM
Yay for Homosexuals. I am Homosexual. You know Virgina wants to make it ok for people to discriminate because of gayness, so Houndoom go live there you'll fit it. I think its easier for Girls to like gay men because they can relate to them better. I think it is funny when men look at lisbean porn them go bash gay men. The Food Network had a gay couple on Food 911. I was cool.
Well I am bi, and I live in Virginia. But I do not agree with that rule. Thats totally sexist. Gay people have rigths too. They are just people like everyone else damnit!

Hidden_Mist
06-27-2006, 10:38 PM
Wow!! You're bi Boogey?? Awesome! I give a round of applause to anyone that can admit they aren't straight!!!

:clap:

TT: I can't get on now since I g2g in a few and the wait for comps is ><, but dude, Boogey! I didn't know you was teh bi-ness,lol. Sweet...I have so many bi/gay/homo friends ^^...

HM: Back again and I think you and any other bi/gay/lesbian person is awesome and you should have rights like the straights..... If you can't get married because of your sexuality, then I don't think anyone should!!!

Kabuki
06-28-2006, 12:58 AM
I feel bad for all the people who can't get married or adopt because their gay. Sometimes if I gay person dies or gets sick the family won't let the partner see the one who is sick. Or when the Partner who is on the adoption certificate dies the one who isn't gets there child that they raised since day one and love like their own, taken away. All because "marriage is between a man and a woman"(*mocking vice*).

gun6
06-28-2006, 01:13 AM
I know that I've already posted in this thread to state my opinion, but I have something else to say:

I. Hate. People. That. Use. Their. Religion. Against. Homosexual. People.

Seriously, if your god, or whoever you beleive in didn't mean for homosexual people to exist... or if it's a "sin", then there wouldn't be homosexual people. Seriously. If you can't take what the world has to offer, go back into your little caves and just SHUT. UP. -_-

Just standing up for an online friend of mine who gets picked on at school for being homosexual, as well as some other people that aren't straight.

Kabuki
06-28-2006, 01:19 AM
Not to mention seperation of church and state. What if I choose to believe in a "god" or "religion" in which all the gay little boys and girls are loved as much as everyone else.

Matt
06-28-2006, 02:21 AM
My girl lived in VA, hopefully she's not gay.

And why didn't I get any applause when I mentioned my twin sister is gay?

Kabuki
06-28-2006, 02:27 AM
YAY! Claps for 10 minutes. "My girl"? what does that mean?

Matt
06-28-2006, 02:31 AM
I'll let you figure that one out for yourself. *walks away*

Kabuki
06-28-2006, 02:34 AM
Do you mean girlfriend, sister, dog, I don't know?

Matt
06-28-2006, 02:36 AM
Well dogs aren't so noticabley gay, and I already said my sister was. That, and I would never call my sister my girl. o_O So yes, my girlfriend.

Kabuki
06-28-2006, 02:37 AM
Why would you wonder if your girlfriend is gay?

Matt
06-28-2006, 02:39 AM
Because she is from Virginia, and people were discussing how Virginians are gay. And I said hopefully she isn't because that would mean she doesn't really have feelings for me...

Kabuki
06-28-2006, 02:42 AM
No, we were discussing how Virgina is trying to make it ok to discriminate against gays.

Matt
06-28-2006, 02:43 AM
Well Boogey said...gah, nevermind. Forget I said anything. ^^'

Hidden_Mist
06-28-2006, 05:25 PM
I used to know alot of gays and lesbians when I was really little because my mom had lots of different friends. They were so nice to me and very sweet. They were like a straight person, just a different sexual orientation and I think it is wrong for people to be so cruel. Ok....I'm not trying to be rascist ok?, but blacks were accepted into the American society and allowed to vote and soon blacks and whites were also getting married and asians were accepted too...people of different religions were accepted by the country.........Also soon women had the same right as men...but no one can seem to accept gays because people think it is a sin or something. I think it is wrong and I don't know how people can be so cruel!!!

Dog of Hellsing
06-29-2006, 11:45 PM
HM has a good point. Sooner or later, hopefully people will realize that homosexuals are people too, just like African Americans and women are.

miyoun
06-30-2006, 12:43 AM
I already said this in the early pages.

Most people can't handle bisexual people in their lives. They think bi's will gay them up, and steal their girlfriends. Which annoys me.

Personaly I'm more lesbian than I am straight these days. Yeah, I have my banter (Chat) with a good bunch of males, I'll call some fit, but I like the womans body more. No one in my school knows this. But seriosuly, here, you get stared at, hit, and followed if your bi. Me and jenni go through this every day. LITERALY EVERY DAY.

Gays should have rights, and kids around 13+ should be more nicer about it.

Kabuki
06-30-2006, 04:08 AM
Lesbians have it better then gays. I don't know it seems girls have people telling them they have to be girly girls, but guys have to be manly men.

Dakota
06-30-2006, 03:35 PM
I'm not gay and I don't support the gay lifestyle, nor do I like it.

Now you can all have fun misinterpreting what I just said.

Seven
06-30-2006, 06:16 PM
I'm not gay and I don't support the gay lifestyle, nor do I like it.

Now you can all have fun misinterpreting what I just said.

What is "the gay lifestyle"?

Lol, funny btw how you feel you need to state that you are not gay when this thread isn't about that :P. Insecure?

I'm a proud lesbiman.

Dakota
07-01-2006, 12:42 AM
What is "the gay lifestyle"?

Lol, funny btw how you feel you need to state that you are not gay when this thread isn't about that :P. Insecure? Elitist?

I'm a proud lesbiman.

The gay lifestyle, as I call it, is just being gay. Nothing really complex about it.

...and when a thread title is as broad as "Homosexuality" I assume we can talk about any homotopics we want, including our own preference. Forgive me if I didn't see the "don't you dare mention what your preference is!" note at the start of this thread. And I think it's extremely funny how gay people constantly attack straight people whenever they simply state that they're not gay themselves. Gay people are the most insecure ones, because they think that every straight person out there is a KKK flag wearing, gay bashing, republican.

!CeMAn
07-01-2006, 01:42 AM
Gay people are the most insecure ones, because they think that every straight person out there is a KKK flag wearing, gay bashing, republican.
OR, that anybody who doesn't think to bother to read the previous posts in a DiSCUSSiON/ DEBATE THREAD, and automatically states(for the record :crackup:) that they aren't gay, is a total homophobic punk.

Matt
07-01-2006, 03:46 AM
Gay people are the most insecure ones, because they think that every straight person out there is a KKK flag wearing, gay bashing, republican.
They don't think, they know. Go out into the real world and take a look around.

Seven
07-01-2006, 11:12 AM
The gay lifestyle, as I call it, is just being gay. Nothing really complex about it.


So what is the alternative? One can either live with someone of the other sex and be deeply unhappy about it, or one can live in celibacy and be deeply unhappy about it. Or, of course, one can just get into a loving relationship - maybe adopt children - and let everyone be happy.
Though I do understand that there's A LOT wrong with that. Cus I mean...read dat Bible! Dat Lord hatez happy people, and he should. Screw love, it's lies, denial and loneliness that gets dem faggies into heaven. And kids, obviously, they'd just get abused all day long :o.

Seriously, I cannot even vaguely understand why people would be opposed to homosexuality, it's an 'opinion' that's as wrong as pure racism. Or it's like saying..."I have nothing against black people! But...interracial relationships are just wrong...:/ God made skin colours for a reason ya know!"

Dakota
07-01-2006, 03:10 PM
OR, that anybody who doesn't think to bother to read the previous posts in a DiSCUSSiON/ DEBATE THREAD, and automatically states(for the record :crackup:) that they aren't gay, is a total homophobic punk.

You're just proving my point. By calling me homophobic simply because I said I'm not gay...? If you said that you were gay, would it make sense for me to call you a heterophobic punk? Same ridiculously stupid logic applies.

They don't think, they know. Go out into the real world and take a look around.

You're proving my point as well. No, not every straight person hates gay people. That is a sweeping generalization, and is insane fallacy. Look at me, I don't hate gay people. I associate with a couple gay people at my college. I simply disagree with their preference because it's against what I believe. Does that make me a kkk flag wearing gay bashing punk? No, it simply means I don't agree with them.

So what is the alternative? One can either live with someone of the other sex and be deeply unhappy about it, or one can live in celibacy and be deeply unhappy about it. Or, of course, one can just get into a loving relationship - maybe adopt children - and let everyone be happy.
Though I do understand that there's A LOT wrong with that. Cus I mean...read dat Bible! Dat Lord hatez happy people, and he should. Screw love, it's lies, denial and loneliness that gets dem faggies into heaven. And kids, obviously, they'd just get abused all day long :o.

Seriously, I cannot even vaguely understand why people would be opposed to homosexuality, it's an 'opinion' that's as wrong as pure racism. Or it's like saying..."I have nothing against black people! But...interracial relationships are just wrong...:/ God made skin colours for a reason ya know!"

Yep, the bible says that homosexuality is wrong. But you can't compare this to racism. People are born their skin color, and I don't believe that people are born gay. I think that 'born gay' thing was something made up to compensate being gay as it became incrediby popular in late 90's and today.

Incongruity
07-01-2006, 05:44 PM
=/ Animals are gay too though (The famous gay penguins event? (http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2004/02/07/MNG3N4RAV41.DTL)). And based on psychological studies (albeit some of them controversial and scientific on a dubious level), the accepted ideas seem to be based on Kinsey, who maintained that bisexuality was natural. Basically, this means that it is as "natural," to an extent as race or sex.

It's obviously not a trend either, as plenty of people were gay before the 90s... (Try looking at ISBN 0394742249).


And yes, if you interpret the Bible in the only legitimate way (fundamentally; think about it for a second, and you'll see that fundamentalist Christians are the only "logical" Christians), homosexuality goes against the Bible. But then again, a fundamentalist interpretation goes against science, logic and reason. Which, by the commutative property, means that fields of intellect are for fags.

akdude
07-01-2006, 05:52 PM
omg! this thread is still going?!?! I'm in and out of here and y'all r still arguin about this crap?! guys! drop it! Homesexuality isn't a big deal. Just leave this topic off of here and move on!

InvertrevnI
07-01-2006, 08:39 PM
omg! this thread is still going?!?! I'm in and out of here and y'all r still arguin about this crap?! guys! drop it! Homesexuality isn't a big deal. Just leave this topic off of here and move on!
Screw that.

I support doing what makes everybody happy. If some people don't like the idea of Homosexual marridge, then don't call it marridge, call it something else. If everybodie's happy, there's nothing to argue over.

akdude
07-01-2006, 09:45 PM
I never said I wasn't agaisnt anything! I have many homosexual friends! I just gettin tired of this stupid thread bein up in the forum! There really isn't a point to have this up b/c all it causes is an arguement, and I am one person who loves to argue, but this is stupid and pointless.

!CeMAn
07-02-2006, 03:55 PM
Dakota, why would you feel the need to state for the record you aren't gay in the first place? Do you fear somebody might think you are gay for supporting them? Unfortunately, that is the definition of homophobia. That, and the constant reassurance of your own sexuality.

Kabuki
07-02-2006, 04:02 PM
I'm not gay and I don't support the gay lifestyle, nor do I like it.

Now you can all have fun misinterpreting what I just said.

What lifestyle, I/we don't do anything thing different then you, I go to school, I come home, watch tv, and go to bed.

Gays don't do anything different then you. We go to work, we try to get married and settle down, and then we get old and0 die(just like everyone else).

A the bible says a joining between a man and woman is about procreation(making babies), not pleasure. It doesn't say anything about the joinging of two men, or two women.(get it straight)

Also I believe people are born gay. I tried being straight once it didn't work out. I just plain can't make myelf want to have sex with girls.

Also I feel I have a reight to be insecure with all the sickos out there who believe its all right to kill me because I'm gay.

And Also I don't think being gay is or will "popular".

Dakota
07-02-2006, 05:30 PM
Dakota, why would you feel the need to state for the record you aren't gay in the first place? Do you fear somebody might think you are gay for supporting them? Unfortunately, that is the definition of homophobia. That, and the constant reassurance of your own sexuality.

Seven and Kabuki not only admitted they were gay up front, but that they were proudly gay. In fact, several people have opened their first post proclaiming they are gay. Why don't you rip them a new one? Why don't ask them why they need to state they are gay in the first place? Why don't you ask them if they're afraid someone might think their straight? Why don't you insult them by calling them 'heterophobes?'

You're taking something so incredibly small and insignificant and blowing it up something it isn't. I said I wasn't gay because (who'd a guessed) I wanted people to know where I come from, and this is a thread about homosexuality.

Echo
07-02-2006, 06:23 PM
Yep, the bible says that homosexuality is wrong. But you can't compare this to racism. People are born their skin color, and I don't believe that people are born gay. I think that 'born gay' thing was something made up to compensate being gay as it became incrediby popular in late 90's and today.

Actually, some people are born gay. Some (using men in this example) men are born with more X chromosomes than Y chromosomes, while it should be that men have more Y's. Thus, the X chromosomes give the man more womenly features and "an ability" to be sexually attracted to other men. Sometimes this lack of Y chromosomes appears as a transgender, causing the man (in this case) to identify himself as a different gender than the one they were assigned at birth.

I do agree with you that being gay became popular in the late 90's - this day. TV Programs like Fab 5 (can't recall if that was the actual name of the program) and some reality-TV shows (Big Brother, etc.) made homosexuality more of popular culture, with fashion and trends, rather than what homosexuality is.

"Oh, let's go shopping! I need a new pink shirt with some purple stripes and a new pair of shoes! *giggle*"

That's what most people think of gays nowadays, because the way the public entertainment introduced them as.

Moving on...

Now you can all have fun misinterpreting what I just said.

I think most people missed this part of your post. If you hadn't put that in your post, I would have made the same assumption as Seven did: insecure? But the word "misinterpret" saved you from my point of view. Meaning that I don't think that you're gay. So, people like Seven and Iceman, you guys should kinda lay off this guy now. Unless, I'm terribly mistaken by saying the above somehow...

@Rayquaza Fan, do you seriously think that there will be a day when everybody's happy? There will always be stuff to argue about, over and over again.

Seven
07-02-2006, 06:39 PM
Seven and Kabuki not only admitted they were gay up front, but that they were proudly gay.

Lol, uhm...not that I feel the need to clarify, but I will none the less, I consider myself a male lesbian as in, an on-going joke between me and mah lesbian GF, SF. =b.
And you're right that you stating that shouldn't be blown up, cus I didn't mean it as a serious point or anything :o.

However, stating that homosexuality isn't inborn, is just ridiculous. Study after study after study after study shows that it is inborn, plus, name me ONE reason why someone would choose to be gay? And please, don't say "attention" "fashion", "abuse' or "lack of a father figure". Cus seriously, just...get out if you believe that.

Kabuki
07-02-2006, 06:58 PM
I never said I was proudly gay I just stated it. Also I felt the need to state it because in this society you are "straight until proven guilty(or gay)". So they think you are insecure for saying you are straight when it is already assumed you are. I also have no problem with so stating your not gay, of corse I figured it out when you said, "I don't support the gay lifestyle". I am only a little upset at the other posts and that quote from that post. Well anyway I've stop caring about things like this because I already accept this is gonna happen alot during my life. Also if you caught it Seven said lesbiman.

I wouldn't choose to be gay, if I could. Also actually one study said that they subconiously choose because they want someone who can complete their non-masculinity. But that still isn't choosing the way they put it.

CHAMPION Victoria
07-10-2006, 10:06 PM
To be honest, my feelings on this are rather split. I'm naturally a tolerant person and don't mind of people do things that don't effect me. On the other hand, I also tend to be judgmental. It's a toss-up.

One of my friends recently came out of the closet and admitted she was a lesbian, though. That put a huge damper on things for my friends and I, because we always think in the back of our mind that there could be an alterior motive for anything she does, and we hesitated inviting her to parties and the like. But it really doesn't make sense, you know, since you could say the same things about inviting anyone of the opposite gender!

It just made me wonder if there's a natural bias against homosexuals that people don't normally take into account. It's probably entire societal, but it's still weird.

Hidden_Mist
07-10-2006, 10:31 PM
To be honest, my feelings on this are rather split. I'm naturally a tolerant person and don't mind of people do things that don't effect me. On the other hand, I also tend to be judgmental. It's a toss-up.

One of my friends recently came out of the closet and admitted she was a lesbian, though. That put a huge damper on things for my friends and I, because we always think in the back of our mind that there could be an alterior motive for anything she does, and we hesitated inviting her to parties and the like. But it really doesn't make sense, you know, since you could say the same things about inviting anyone of the opposite gender!

It just made me wonder if there's a natural bias against homosexuals that people don't normally take into account. It's probably entire societal, but it's still weird.

Most people aren't used to it. Just a question.....Why did you hesitate to invite your friend to stuff? Did it embarrase you that she was a lesbian? I wouldn't be bothered if one of my firends came out of the closet. It is probably because my mom had lots of homosexual friends. Did you grow up anywhere near any gay people. If you didn't that is probably why you kind of......egh. It's okay.

Kabuki
07-10-2006, 11:38 PM
I'm just wondering if you think that just because a man is a man that he is attracted to you. No right. So why just because she likes girls in general do you think she is attracted to you. For all you know she might think your ugly but have a good personality and that is why shes your friend. All I ask that you would treat just like anyone of your other friends but maybe more like an ugly guy(assuming you like men not girls) that also has a little insight into your girl feelings(pms, etc.). You know what I mean?

For me personally I'm very picky about men I like you have to be thin, but muscular, but not too muscular. Of corse an ugly face can ruin a pretty body.

All I'm saying is don't treat her like that just because your insecure. Also in it happens that she is attracted to you just tell her you like men, and your not interested and she'll back off.

CHAMPION Victoria
07-11-2006, 12:20 AM
Mist: Kabuki got the gist of it--in a way, at least. There's a certain awkardness that we all experience around her now.

Kabuki: Oh, believe me, rationality suggests that we treat her no differently than we'd treat anyone else. If you'll notice, I've already said that upfront.

I, in fact, highlighted the discrepancy and have pointed out that it isn't something I can turn off with a mindset. It just feels weird, and those are the sorts of things you can't just turn off with a rationalization.

Besides, she has told us that she finds us attractive.

Hidden_Mist
07-17-2006, 09:07 PM
Mist: Kabuki got the gist of it--in a way, at least. There's a certain awkardness that we all experience around her now.

Kabuki: Oh, believe me, rationality suggests that we treat her no differently than we'd treat anyone else. If you'll notice, I've already said that upfront.

I, in fact, highlighted the discrepancy and have pointed out that it isn't something I can turn off with a mindset. It just feels weird, and those are the sorts of things you can't just turn off with a rationalization.

Besides, she has told us that she finds us attractive. Have you told her you are into guys??

Echo
07-17-2006, 09:23 PM
Have you told her you are into guys??

Please refrain from casual chat on this board as I am quite confident that it isn't really allowed and is only frowned upon.

Hidden_Mist
07-17-2006, 09:34 PM
Please refrain from casual chat on this board as I am quite confident that it isn't really allowed and is only frowned upon.


I was just asking a question. It's not off the topic, so I should be allowed to do it....

Echo
07-17-2006, 09:50 PM
I was just asking a question. It's not off the topic, so I should be allowed to do it....

Eh, it's odd when on a debate board you're not asking neither, a rhetorical or a sarcastic question, but a casual question, which you could easily ask over PM or by another method. I'm not saying that you were off-topic, which I am going now, I was just merely stating that you should keep the 'Other Chat' in the directed board or on PM/Messengers.

blastoy
07-17-2006, 09:58 PM
:wink: There is nothing wrong with Homosexuals IMO they should be treated the smae as everybody else.

uh.. i don't think so.. i think people should stay away from them. ( No offence )

Matt
07-17-2006, 10:31 PM
So now they are leppers? Maybe I should stay away from you because you are short. Your shortness is going to rub off on me? I bet you get nowhere in society.

Actually, some people are born gay. Some (using men in this example) men are born with more X chromosomes than Y chromosomes, while it should be that men have more Y's. Thus, the X chromosomes give the man more womenly features and "an ability" to be sexually attracted to other men. Sometimes this lack of Y chromosomes appears as a transgender, causing the man (in this case) to identify himself as a different gender than the one they were assigned at birth.
There is not a specific diffusion of X and Y chromosomes in your body. It is either one or the other, not a mixture of both. You can't have "more X chromosomes," unless, in fact, you have more cells. You are correct that you are born gay, but it is more based on sexual preference controlled by the hypothalamus gland in the brain. Homosexuals have a small but distinct difference hypothalamus compared to heterosexuals. This one part was found in gay sheep to be the only difference between gays and straights, and is coincidentally responsible for sexual hormones and preferences. Sheep are unique because they are, next to humans, the only species that can clearly show homosexual preference, with one in ten rams preferring not to mate with ewes. A follow-up study with humans resembled very similar results.

So what we have is a noticable physical birth "retardation," a variance from heterosexuals, that shows that humans ARE in fact born gay.

Dog of Hellsing
07-17-2006, 10:32 PM
Eh, it's odd when on a debate board you're not asking neither, a rhetorical or a sarcastic question, but a casual question, which you could easily ask over PM or by another method. I'm not saying that you were off-topic, which I am going now, I was just merely stating that you should keep the 'Other Chat' in the directed board or on PM/Messengers.

Actually it's on-topic, so she's allowed to ask it. This is a topic about homosexuality, so it's valid.

~* Esper *~
07-17-2006, 10:37 PM
Plus Echo, this isn't technically a debate, more like a discussion ....

Echo
07-17-2006, 11:03 PM
Actually it's on-topic, so she's allowed to ask it. This is a topic about homosexuality, so it's valid.

Actually, I never said that it was not allowed, I just stated that it could be done by another method and that it really doesn't promote any intellectual discussion here.

Plus Echo, this isn't technically a debate, more like a discussion ....

Well, technically, by saying that, and by disagreeing with me, you're making this a debate because our matters on some subject differ.

Matt
07-17-2006, 11:12 PM
This is the second time my intelligence has gone ignored. -___-

And echo, the question was perfectly valid.

Echo
07-17-2006, 11:19 PM
This is the second time my intelligence has gone ignored. -___-

And echo, the question was perfectly valid.

Sorry, I should've quoted you too, but I don't have that much time; I'll get to it tomorrow. ;)

CHAMPION Victoria
07-18-2006, 05:31 AM
Mist: Oh, she's aware.

Incidentally, this thread is mostly more of a personal discussion since we're using opinions more than justifiable reasons. So long as the discussion is thoughtful and intelligent, it's not just "chat." I, for example, am trying to make it a discussion about mental perceptions of homosexuals and that sort of thing.

For example, Mist just asked me if my friend is aware that we're all straight. She is, in fact. The concern isn't whether or not my friend will harrass us or proposition us, but rather, more of an uneasiness around her.

It's an unease around someone who might have alterior motives behind doing anything with us. It's an unease that won't let us relax around her.

I qualify this by saying that yes, I'm aware the same things could be said about people of the opposite gender. The fact that it doesn't happen in that instance is what makes it odd. It's what makes me, a person who has been tolerant of homosexuality in the past, wonder why I'm feeling this way now that I know someone who is definately a lesbian.

It's strange. It could be entirely a societal or imagined thing, but I'm not sure.

Kabuki
07-18-2006, 05:53 AM
:wink:

uh.. i don't think so.. i think people should stay away from them. ( No offence )
lol, it doesn't rub off. Also how do you plan on accomplishing this? You realize just going to school you incounter gays. Is it starting to rub off? *gasp*

Seven
07-18-2006, 02:05 PM
:wink:

uh.. i don't think so.. i think people should stay away from them. ( No offence )

lol @ how you say no offence

I have no problem with black people, but I do think REAL people (whites) should stay away from them...They can have their own busses and neighbourhoods and everyone will be glad :D. (no offence cuz I'm not a racist I'm just expressing my "opinion")

Matt
07-18-2006, 10:45 PM
Why does everyone spell offense and defense (including my name) with a c?!

Learn to spell.

Seven
07-18-2006, 10:51 PM
Why does everyone spell offense and defense (including my name) with a c?!

Learn to spell.

Differences in British and American spelling, my love <33

Surly Professor
07-18-2006, 10:53 PM
Why does everyone spell offense and defense (including my name) with a c?!

Learn to spell.
They're both acceptable in modern english.

Get with the times.

Matt
07-18-2006, 10:53 PM
Gah stupid brits. It's like when you say realise, or mum.

Dakota
07-19-2006, 12:15 AM
There is not a specific diffusion of X and Y chromosomes in your body. It is either one or the other, not a mixture of both. You can't have "more X chromosomes," unless, in fact, you have more cells. You are correct that you are born gay, but it is more based on sexual preference controlled by the hypothalamus gland in the brain. Homosexuals have a small but distinct difference hypothalamus compared to heterosexuals. This one part was found in gay sheep to be the only difference between gays and straights, and is coincidentally responsible for sexual hormones and preferences. Sheep are unique because they are, next to humans, the only species that can clearly show homosexual preference, with one in ten rams preferring not to mate with ewes. A follow-up study with humans resembled very similar results.

So what we have is a noticable physical birth "retardation," a variance from heterosexuals, that shows that humans ARE in fact born gay.

Sheep aren't humans, and humans aren't sheep. It's apples and oranges.

Incongruity
07-19-2006, 01:30 AM
Tigers are fairly heterosexual. Tigers like tigresses. They seem to be naturally born heterosexual.

Woops. Tigers aren't humans, and humans aren't tigers. It's apples and oranges.

So I guess that means humans are naturally gay.

Alienshroom
07-19-2006, 01:57 AM
I think Homosexuals are looked down apon A LOT its not right for the general public to make fun of peaple for it

PokéJungle
07-19-2006, 02:18 AM
I take the Christian view that practicing homosexuality isn't good.

MSN just came out with an article that said boys who have a couple older brothers are more likely to be gay though. So some of you can come out of the cloest. Science is always right.

At least if you ask Science, it'll tell you that it's always right.

CHAMPION Victoria
07-19-2006, 08:45 AM
Actually, Science makes no such claim. Science is always willing to be corrected and proven wrong.

Echo
07-19-2006, 03:46 PM
Actually, Science makes no such claim. Science is always willing to be corrected and proven wrong.

Thank you.

PokéJungle, if being a homosexual is a sin, are you aware that according to the Bible, taking a shower naked is as sinful as homosexuality?

Yes, I'm a Christian, I belive in God, but I have nothing against homosexuals. Now, do I go to Hell for that, won't I be able to pass through the gates of Heaven? People, as general, have already been doomed (or so to say) to being sinful, so why do so many Christians try so hard to be good and innocent while they cannot be.

meh.

PokéJungle
07-19-2006, 06:27 PM
Thank you.

PokéJungle, if being a homosexual is a sin, are you aware that according to the Bible, taking a shower naked is as sinful as homosexuality?

Yes, I'm a Christian, I belive in God, but I have nothing against homosexuals. Now, do I go to Hell for that, won't I be able to pass through the gates of Heaven? People, as general, have already been doomed (or so to say) to being sinful, so why do so many Christians try so hard to be good and innocent while they cannot be.

meh.
I have nothing against homosexual people. God gave us free will, and they're excercising that right.

Personally, I just feel it's a sin. I'm not saying I'm perfect, because I'm obviously not. We all sin in different ways, and I won't claim that one is better or worse than another.

Echo
07-19-2006, 07:01 PM
I take the Christian view that practicing homosexuality isn't good.

Eh, if you have nothing against homosexuals, then why the above comment? Isn't taking a view of something the same as your opinion?

PokéJungle
07-19-2006, 07:06 PM
I have nothing against the people, I just don't agree with what they're doing.

Hmmm, I need a good metaphor. Say everyone's like vanilla ice cream. Some people choose to put different sauces on themselves. Homosexuality is like chocolate sauce, which I don't like. I still like the ice cream though.

Not sure if that was good or not, but I tried.

blastoy
07-19-2006, 07:06 PM
So now they are leppers? Maybe I should stay away from you because you are short. Your shortness is going to rub off on me? I bet you get nowhere in society.


I was saying an opinion.. i haven't met one yet so.. i really don't know how they act

Seven
07-19-2006, 07:10 PM
I have nothing against the people, I just don't agree with what they're doing.

Hmmm, I need a good metaphor. Say everyone's like vanilla ice cream. Some people choose to put different sauces on themselves. Homosexuality is like chocolate sauce, which I don't like. I still like the ice cream though.

Not sure if that was good or not, but I tried.

I really respect your stance, especially the words "I'm not saying I'm perfect, because I'm obviously not. We all sin in different ways, and I won't claim that one is better or worse than another.". That's what I think more conservative christians should realise, and perhaps they'd be less hypocritical on subjects.

Though, you do assume homosexuality is a choice, which it is not.

I was saying an opinion.. i haven't met one yet so.. i really don't know how they act

And he is showing you why it is unfounded. This is the debate forum, not the "State-your-opinion"-forum.

PokéJungle
07-19-2006, 07:18 PM
Blastoy, homosexuals are human. Believe it or not, they act like every one else. Unless they're very outwardly flambouant, you can't tell a person's sexuality. And even then, don't judge on how people act unless they start snuggling up against the same sex.

Homosexuality being a choice or in the genes is still a grey area for me.

Dog of Hellsing
07-19-2006, 08:45 PM
PokeJungle, I like how you stated your feelings ^^.

Anyways, you've got a point. Even someone who acts gay may not really be a homo, so meh, reserve judgement people. And even if they are gay, is it hurting anyone?

PokéJungle
07-19-2006, 08:47 PM
PokeJungle, I like how you stated your feelings ^^.

Anyways, you've got a point. Even someone who acts gay may not really be a homo, so meh, reserve judgement people. And even if they are gay, is it hurting anyone?
I can't stand people who say someone's gay when they don't actually *know* them. Jack Sparrow is a good example. He could be termed "gay" because of his personality, but obviously he loves Kiera Knightly. Like me.

</bad movie tie-in>

That's just one of my pet peeves though.

Dog of Hellsing
07-19-2006, 09:18 PM
I can't stand people who say someone's gay when they don't actually *know* them. Jack Sparrow is a good example. He could be termed "gay" because of his personality, but obviously he loves Kiera Knightly. Like me.

</bad movie tie-in>

That's just one of my pet peeves though.

XD Shameless movie plug...classic...

But yeah, I used to have a choir teacher who could really sound and act like a gay guy, but he had a wife and three kids. Even if he had been gay I wouldn't care, he was the best teacher I ever had.

PokéJungle
07-19-2006, 09:20 PM
XD Shameless movie plug...classic...

But yeah, I used to have a choir teacher who could really sound and act like a gay guy, but he had a wife and three kids. Even if he had been gay I wouldn't care, he was the best teacher I ever had.
Same thing with my english teacher.

He discussed the hotness of the guy who played Romeo at the end of the year with some girls. Some people don't believe he actually has a wife.

Orre Champion
08-17-2006, 11:35 PM
eh,it's there life they can do whAT THEY LIKE.

Kabuki
08-18-2006, 12:30 AM
PokeJungle, I like how you stated your feelings ^^.

Anyways, you've got a point. Even someone who acts gay may not really be a homo, so meh, reserve judgement people. And even if they are gay, is it hurting anyone?
I agree does someone being gay really affect your life in any way. Ok so if you are related to one a little but not drastically, it doesn't hurt you(only what you do to yourself by fighting it). Just shut up and let them live their lives.

Dakota
08-18-2006, 01:58 AM
That's called relativism. Example:

Person A: I am pro choice

Person B: Why do you think that?

Person A: Who cares! I have my right to an opinion and you have no right to tell me I'm wrong.

Yeah, there are people out there that are gay and it doesn't directly affect me at all. But I don't like living in a society that accepts homosexuality as 'just another traditional family.' That's why I have these arguments, so that maybe society will think otherwise.

Just so you know guys, there's an agenda out there. And right now, the agenda is to push that homosexuality is perfectly natural. Homosexuality (sinning) is winning the war right now.

Matt
08-18-2006, 02:15 AM
Being the atheist here, the only thing that I can closely relate to sinning is physically or emotionally damaging another human. There is nothing wrong with being lustful, that's why "God" created euphoria. It is not hurting anyone, and it is one's free will. There is nothing wrong with being proud. It's good to show you care about your actions, and your pride, if anything, encourages others, but the dumbasses who wrote the bible see it as a sin. Just the same, homosexuality does not harm anyone in the least, and the only "sin" you could possibly perform concerning it is to disallow it and not let the homosexual be with the one he or she loves, causing him or her emotional distress.

Dakota
08-18-2006, 02:29 AM
If I were an atheist, I'd be on the exact same plane as you D2...

Thank God I'm not an athiest.

Matt
08-18-2006, 02:34 AM
If I were an atheist, I'd be on the exact same plane as you D2...

Thank God I'm not an athiest.
XD good line.

I just don't want to live life by "the book." I want to write my own book. I will follow my own rules and beliefs, not what someone tells me to believe. Nobody's will is greater than my own, for this life is mine. It's not "God's" life. It's mine.

!CeMAn
08-18-2006, 03:51 AM
How is having sex with your gender a sin?
If somebody only wants their same gender, that's what they want. Nobody chooses it, Dakota. Commiting sin is the idea that you're making a choice between right and wrong, it's not having a preference.

If i prefer to eat regular cheddar Kraft Dinner, and my friend prefers the white cheddar, which one of us is sinning? According to you, only one is the right preference, regardless of our own feelings. I think women are desirable, so i have sex with them. Men repulse me, so i don't have sex with them. My female friend thinks women are desirable, so she has sex with them. Men repulse her, so she doesn't have sex with them.

There is another agenda out there. It's been in effect for centuries.
I honestly, truly, feel sorry for anybody who lets a church tell them what to think. You're brain- washed. You belong to a cult, one of the oldest, most cleverly disguised cults in history.

The mother ship is not coming for you, but please, drink the Kool-Aid.

Surly Professor
08-19-2006, 01:18 AM
If I were an atheist, I'd be on the exact same plane as you D2...
Oh no you di'n't!
Are you gonna take that Defense?
Oh snap! Cut down!
:crackup:

Vampire
08-19-2006, 01:30 AM
!ceMAn!:eek:
Wow, those were some powerfull words! And I hear you!

Matt
08-19-2006, 02:40 AM
Oh no you di'n't!
Are you gonna take that Defense?
Oh snap! Cut down!
:crackup:
He's open to his ideas. If anyone'll take him down it'll be that gay guy in the corner with his pink leather man-wip.

*points to Ice*

Steak
08-19-2006, 02:45 AM
XD good line.

I just don't want to live life by "the book." I want to write my own book. I will follow my own rules and beliefs, not what someone tells me to believe. Nobody's will is greater than my own, for this life is mine. It's not "God's" life. It's mine.
O_o
Zomga.
I've been wanting to hear that my whole life.
Thank you.
You've completed me.
xDDD Joking.

!CeMAn
08-19-2006, 02:48 AM
He's open to his ideas. If anyone'll take him down it'll be that gay guy in the corner with his pink leather man-wip.

*points to Ice*
:crackup: Feeeeck offff!!
Just because i rock a leather whip and sometimes rape men, doesn't mean i like it.

Sudo
08-19-2006, 11:38 AM
Havn't you heard?! Gay is this summers hottest trend!

Dakota
08-20-2006, 01:52 PM
How is having sex with your gender a sin?

Bible says so. Read it.

If somebody only wants their same gender, that's what they want. Nobody chooses it, Dakota.

True. For instance, I love women because I just do.

Commiting sin is the idea that you're making a choice between right and wrong, it's not having a preference.

Commiting sin is doing the opposite of what the bible says. Sin is biblical. If there was no God, there would be no such thing as sin and people could do whatever they want. Read the bible.

If i prefer to eat regular cheddar Kraft Dinner, and my friend prefers the white cheddar, which one of us is sinning?

Uh...neither. That's a stupid example. Read the bible.

According to you, only one is the right preference,

I never said that. Or anything remotely close to that. Read my posts before you put words in my mouth.

regardless of our own feelings. I think women are desirable, so i have sex with them. Which is a sin outside of marriage Men repulse me, so i don't have sex with them. My female friend thinks women are desirable, so she has sex with them. Men repulse her, so she doesn't have sex with them.

There is another agenda out there. It's been in effect for centuries.
I honestly, truly, feel sorry for anybody who lets a church tell them what to think. You're brain- washed. You belong to a cult, one of the oldest, most cleverly disguised cults in history.

The bible says you'd say that. Heh. Read the bible.

The mother ship is not coming for you, but please, drink the Kool-Aid.

You haven't pwned anybody.

Matt
08-20-2006, 02:11 PM
You haven't pwned anybody.
Basically your answer to his anti-biblical sin rant and very notable points was "read the bible." Until you can come up with a good opposing rebuttle to his statements, you are pretty much pwnt.

Dakota
08-20-2006, 05:39 PM
Basically your answer to his anti-biblical sin rant and very notable points was "read the bible." Until you can come up with a good opposing rebuttle to his statements, you are pretty much pwnt.

That is a good opposing rebuttal because he's TALKING about the bible.

Sin is biblical. If there was no God, there would be no such thing as sin and people could do whatever they want.

If he's questioning why things are sins (and the only mention of sin in all of world literature is the bible) then the bible would tell us what is and is not sin (which it does). His post didn't ask what is right and wrong, it's asking about what's a sin or not.

I kept on saying "read the bible" because it's obvious he hasn't if he was making totally ignorant statements like that. A 10 year old kid who's gone through sunday school could answer those questions of 'what's a sin.'

Seawolf
08-20-2006, 05:42 PM
I kept on saying "read the bible" because it's obvious he hasn't if he was making totally ignorant statements like that. A 10 year old kid who's gone through sunday school could answer those questions of 'what's a sin.'

Not everyone believes in that silly book, so your arguments are also questionable.

Matt
08-20-2006, 05:44 PM
Not everyone believes in that silly book, so your arguments are also questionable.
I think we've proven that, at least on this forum, Dakota is the only one that believes what he reads in that book.

I'm thinking I should start following a book too, Dakota, since you are so pursuasive. I'll choose The Stranger. Step 1: Find an Arab to kill.

Dakota
08-20-2006, 05:48 PM
Not everyone believes in that silly book, so your arguments are also questionable.
Not everyone believes people are born gay, but I've still seen that argument used plenty of times. The bible is just as legit as any source. How many contradictionless, unaltered, 4000 year old science books can you name? There are things in every high school text book that have been proven wrong a hundred years ago, but they still use em.

If he's asking about sin, the only way to respond to him is by what the bible says about sin because the bible is the only book on the planet that talks about sin. If there was no bible, or God, there would be no sin and no right and wrong.

Dakota
08-20-2006, 05:50 PM
I think we've proven that, at least on this forum, Dakota is the only one that believes what he reads in that book.

I'm thinking I should start following a book too, Dakota, since you are so pursuasive. I'll choose The Stranger. Step 1: Find an Arab to kill.

You guys haven't proven a thing to anybody. Calling the bible silly doesn't disprove it, it just makes you look immature and with no argument aside from ad hominem. And I'm not the only one that believes the bible. Seriously, grow up and use something that's debateable.

boltAge
08-20-2006, 07:18 PM
Dakota, the whole point is, have you realised not everybody is a Christian? Your argument is as convincing as "I'm right because all of you are wrong".

Devotion to your religion is cool, but respect for other people's religions is also important. You're not respecting them by enforcing your religious views on them.

Anyway, Dakota, since the bible has contradicting statements, meaning that some of those statements are inaccurate, could the forbiddance of homosexuality in the bible be inaccurate too?

Honestly, religion and philosophy don't match. It's like mixing cookies and tea. Tastes like crap.

!CeMAn
08-21-2006, 06:03 AM
UNALTERED, Dakota?
Hang on, hang on... i'm wiping tears of laughter from my eyes.
Ok, dude you know the Bible wasn't written in English, right? Do you know how many times it was translated and re-written in several different languages? Trust me, it's not the same words it was 4000 years ago.

Second of all, i have read the Bible. Most of it(the entire New Testament at least). I spent 13 years in Catholic school, not to mention attended Catholic Mass a large amount of times. So, not only have i seen most of what that piece of literature has to offer, but i've been taught what it means and how to interpret it. I'm far from a 10 year old who failed "Sunday School".
In fact, one might compare your school of thought on sin to a small child's; The Bible says it's wrong, so it is. Jesus told me not to do it, so i don't.

Believe it or not, we "believe" in the same god. I just feel that my version crated humans to think freely and come up with their own answers. Just as it created birds to fly and fish to swim, humans think, and the good Lord knows that. What kind of god punishes it's creatures for doing exactly what it was meant to do? Might as well beat an infant for crying because it's hungry, or kick a dog for barking when it sees a cat.

The answers to life and the difference between right and wrong are not in the Bible. They're inside your own brain. Try using it.
That's what God gave it to you for.

Vulcan
08-21-2006, 06:07 AM
If homosexuality was meant to be an accepted part of life there wouldnt be all this arguing and debating

Thats just my opinion

Vulcan
08-21-2006, 06:15 AM
False! but I see your point with the other two examples so good way to put it.

I have nothing against homosexuals and I guess they do deserve the same rights as other people but people COME ON you guys don't see the logic. A human has one purpose and one purpose only; To Reproduce. Now how are we suppose to reproduce when we have gay couples and marriages? That is why homosexuality is wrong. It makes sense too. A man's pen(s fits in a woman's vag)na to REPRODUCE. If [hypothetically]suddenly everybody on the planet were homosexuals the human race would end. As simple as that. We don't need religion to interfere with common sense. I am not saying that we should kill all the homos out there. It's just that homosexuality should not exist to begin with. Animals that have homosexual behavior have nothing to do with this. Just because some do have homosexual behaviors doesn't mean that all of them do.

I bet someone is gonna refute me with some stupid example of some politician.

My bad for double posting, but I found this persons argument very good.

Ali the Dark One
08-21-2006, 07:26 AM
EDIT button is in the bottom right corner just so you know Vulcan. I live by my own philosophy (although people never listen to me because I'm 12 :susp:) If someone is homosexual, it is in their brain. If somebody is gay and they are made fun of by other people because they are gay, they can just not be gay anymore but they will probably not be able to think different. It is not bad that they are gay, just because they're different then the other person making fun of them doesn't mean they're bad; sometimes it is hard to swim against the current but that doesn't mean you should turn around becausse the current pushes against you, the current is sometimes stubborn and will not give in even though it should just stop and try to not mind. For example: my sister is not straight and my mother is chriatian, even though my mother is dissapointed at the fact that my sister is not straight my mom does not force her. :tongue: I need to start a fortune cookie business (even though I barely have an idea of what I just said, it kinda throws out through your thoughts) :confused: whatever!

Seawolf
08-21-2006, 07:32 AM
Second of all, i have read the Bible. Most of it(the entire New Testament at least). I spent 13 years in Catholic school, not to mention attended Catholic Mass a large amount of times. So, not only have i seen most of what that piece of literature has to offer, but i've been taught what it means and how to interpret it. I'm far from a 10 year old who failed "Sunday School".

Dear lord (pun intended?), !Ce ... I never imagined you as a squeaky clean Catholic school boy. :biggrin:

Matt
08-21-2006, 02:00 PM
If homosexuality was meant to be an accepted part of life there wouldnt be all this arguing and debating

Thats just my opinion
It's argued because people don't see it as acceptable, though it very well should be accepted.

And excuse me while Ice and I go off to do things only we men can do alone together for that was a completely amazing post.

Echo
08-21-2006, 02:15 PM
UNALTERED, Dakota?
Hang on, hang on... i'm wiping tears of laughter from my eyes.
Ok, dude you know the Bible wasn't written in English, right? Do you know how many times it was translated and re-written in several different languages? Trust me, it's not the same words it was 4000 years ago.

And exactly how do you know that it's not the same? Were you present 4000 years ago?

Sure, I have read words/books about how the Bible was edited by Roman emperors, etc., but there is no certain information of how much the Bible has changed over the years, if at all. Though, it's more than possible that the words are not the same, but I seriously doubt that the whole meaning of the book's messages has been changed, no matter what language it was translated to.

Also, ali#######, please refrain from posting such badly spelled, smiley-infected and grammar-lacking posts.

RedRoninMan
08-21-2006, 02:32 PM
I dont care if someone is gay but I do get excrucially annoyed when someone acts flamboyant or stereotypically gay. Theres no real need for it!