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View Poll Results: Well? Are they?
Yes. New games are just gimmicks, and suck. 1 11.11%
Well I like the new games and all, but...I think they are. 3 33.33%
I kinda like the new games, so I guess that they aren't. 1 11.11%
Not by a long shot! I love the new games! 4 44.44%
Voters: 9. You may not vote on this poll

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  #1  
Old 02-18-2012, 07:50 AM
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Default Are Sonic's best days gone?

I think not.

And you know why? Because:

1. The games are still fun! If you think of them like I do. Most people(as in the die-hard fans) will tell you that Sonic sucks now, but I think Generations told us something. Modern and Classic are two different entities, and should be considered different. Sure, there isn't much platforming in newer Sonic games, but these are modern games! Maybe Sonic has just evolved into something more than just a platformer, even if those days were amazing all the same. Again, I think Generations did a great job in showcasing both of these "eras" if you will, the speedy, 3D Sonic the newcomers know, and the calmer, 2D platforming Sonic us old players know and love.

2. "All new Sonic games have some stupid gimmick! THEY ALL SUCK!" Is a blatant lie. If people took the game the way they should, as a game, and not a continuation of a series/sequel, they would enjoy the game a lot more. I loved Sonic Unleashed. Yeah, sure, it had it's quirks. I loved the Day stages, and I liked the Night stages too. If people looked at the game as a game instead of what they want it to be, they would love it.

3. People are too hasty. Just because there hasn't been a game that was exactly what they wanted, that definitely does not mean that he hasn't had good games. Okay, so Sonic and the Secret Rings sucked. Okay, so Sonic and the Black Knight was meh and short. They're just experimenting to see what the fans want. I personally want a Sonic Adventure 3, haha! but hey, I'll gladly take another Sonic Colors or Unleashed.

Maybe it's because I can look at my taskbar and see that it's 2:47 AM, but I really just wanted to know what you think. So please, feel free to vote and put your two cents in the form of a quick post in here.
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  #2  
Old 02-18-2012, 10:06 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Max0596 View Post
I think not.

And you know why? Because:

1. The games are still fun! If you think of them like I do. Most people(as in the die-hard fans) will tell you that Sonic sucks now, but I think Generations told us something. Modern and Classic are two different entities, and should be considered different. Sure, there isn't much platforming in newer Sonic games, but these are modern games! Maybe Sonic has just evolved into something more than just a platformer, even if those days were amazing all the same. Again, I think Generations did a great job in showcasing both of these "eras" if you will, the speedy, 3D Sonic the newcomers know, and the calmer, 2D platforming Sonic us old players know and love.

2. "All new Sonic games have some stupid gimmick! THEY ALL SUCK!" Is a blatant lie. If people took the game the way they should, as a game, and not a continuation of a series/sequel, they would enjoy the game a lot more. I loved Sonic Unleashed. Yeah, sure, it had it's quirks. I loved the Day stages, and I liked the Night stages too. If people looked at the game as a game instead of what they want it to be, they would love it.

3. People are too hasty. Just because there hasn't been a game that was exactly what they wanted, that definitely does not mean that he hasn't had good games. Okay, so Sonic and the Secret Rings sucked. Okay, so Sonic and the Black Knight was meh and short. They're just experimenting to see what the fans want. I personally want a Sonic Adventure 3, haha! but hey, I'll gladly take another Sonic Colors or Unleashed.

Maybe it's because I can look at my taskbar and see that it's 2:47 AM, but I really just wanted to know what you think. So please, feel free to vote and put your two cents in the form of a quick post in here.

You have to keep in mind that these games "suck" to them. It may be a great game to you, but others do not think so. When one makes a statement that Sonic "sucks" as a whole, it is normally fact that the majority rules.
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Old 02-18-2012, 11:25 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Didnt vote because my choice is only half of one. Are Sonic's best days gone? "Not by a long shot!" (but in my opinion the new games are mostly only average)

I think that Sonic still has many great games to come but in the mean time it is sort of amusing (in a way) to watch him stumble around and get attached to poor decision making in games time and time again. On the bright side though if you think back to early Sonic on the genesis, his health depends on always having at least 1 ring left and so long as he can grab that last ring before each diasaster hits, he can stay alive forever!
  #4  
Old 02-19-2012, 05:02 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Yes and no.

I love the new games, but...I feel there is something missing. I'm not one of those fans who are unable to be pleased, but...The shortness of the games really kills me, and the somewhat stiff controls.

In short, I long for the Adventure days again...But I enjoy the games as they are.

Sonic Generations was a great game, but I was disappointed by it. Too short, many missed opportunities, and the overall lack of humor that had been in the previous few games...Oh, and the two hour long story game play.

Black Knight was, for some reason, a lot of fun for me to play. Not sure why. I loved the story and the gameplay. So in short, almost every other game I have "liked", not loved like Sonic Adventure 2, Black Knight, and Shadow the Hedgehog (LE GASP! She liked this game?!).


But I have to agree with pe2k Voices. At the same time though, the messed up fanbase which can never be pleased also is strangling to the series to death. SEGA gets credit for trying new formulas, unlike a certain plumber...
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Old 02-19-2012, 05:23 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

@Voices: That's why I'm asking you, XD because I want to know if others think the same as me. Sure, I'm probably not right, but that's why there's a poll :3 so you can voice your opinion.

@PikaChew: Yeah, there has been a few bad decisions, but I personally think that it's overall a positive thing. And didn't people think that Adventure wasn't a "true" Sonic game way back then? But then they tried it instead of listening to their friends, and loved the game. I think that if the world wasn't like it is now, where the list of game traits wasn't so messed up, we would have better games.

@Grassy: Yeah, it's a really...odd situation for the blue blur these days. I loved Shadow too XD it was so much fun getting all the endings! But you're right, the controls aren't what they used to be, and none of the new games compare to Adventure/Adventure 2's massive length. There's just something satisfying about finishing a game that took you months and months instead of a few weeks.

BTW, the list of game traits is a little something I made up. A pyramid of what a person looks for in a game, basically.

Back in 2000:
Gameplay
Story
Graphics
BGM/other assorted traits
General Consensus(There wasn't Twitter or Facebook, nor blogs to say whether a game was good or not)

2012:
General Consensus("This game sucks!" written by a famous internet celeb/people googling to see others opinions on a game on IGN may make people not try a game they could love. Also, that total D-bag who says that games suck because he can't play them. Hate that guy >.>)
Graphics(Did you see the new trailer for Skyrim? IT LOOKS SO GREAT!)
Story
Music
Gameplay(Game still looked awesome!)
(Note: sometimes story and gameplay/music are switched.)
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Old 02-19-2012, 05:47 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Ha ha, very true. IGN somehow gave Unleashed a WORSE rating that Sonic 2006. Yeah. That game. I haven't even played it and I get furious at it XD


Here's what I look for;

Story
Gameplay
BGM
Graphics


I don't really count a "consensus" to be honest. He he. But graphics are pretty low on my score. Story is the highest (which is where Generations lost a lot of points). Gameplay is important (again, Generations lost some points). BGM (music helps make a game. SEGA never falters here!).

Most games now have good graphics, so I don't really mind.


But this way of thinking probably explains why Quake (1996 PC game) is my favorite game ever, not so much for story but for BGM and gameplay.
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Old 02-19-2012, 07:53 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

How the hell did Unleashed get a worse score than a game that undoes itself? Seriously, the one game I will never play in any way shape or form was 2006. I only read about it. That, and since it effectively didn't happen, I don't consider Blaze/Silver being from the future as canon.

Topic question: No, but we need more games like Generations. There IS a reason why they're making a Sonic 4. Although I won't buy it until they make a compilation. People want more platformer, and games that don't take 2 hours to beat. I personally enjoyed Unleashed and Rings too. Not as much as Adventure/2 and Heroes, which both helped me create my OC, but really they weren't bad. Rings just had a much different control scheme. If they had remade that game as either a platformer or a "modern style" it would have been less of a "suffer through for story" for me. I liked the story, didn't like the gameplay.

What I dislike the most is that ALL games after Sonic 3 + Knuckles have this "achievement" system, artificially bloating the time spent on it. What if I just wanna play the story? Yes, story. I'm a fan of story, and I personally think none of the modern style games have had a poor story.
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  #8  
Old 02-19-2012, 12:49 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grassy_Aggron View Post



But I have to agree with pe2k Voices. At the same time though, the messed up fanbase which can never be pleased also is strangling to the series to death. SEGA gets credit for trying new formulas, unlike a certain plumber...
You act as though Nintendo exclusively milks their customer's souls. I was under the impression that all companies do that.
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  #9  
Old 02-19-2012, 02:18 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

The issue of the matter was that Sonic didn't actually transition to 3D nearly as well as Mario did. The design team didn't think over some of the relevant design issues with Sonic's transition, and they have ended suffering for that. That is, the formula of "fast" that Sonic was known for wasn't nearly as apparent in the 3D world as Mario was on jumping on goombas.

The crazy sword and gun stuff was...well crazy.
  #10  
Old 02-19-2012, 05:11 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

@Grassy: I meant "concensus" as in what everyone views the game as. By the way, that rating proves that IGN is just...not very knowledgeable. I played Sonic '06 once, basically:

-The scripted scenes kill themselves all the time.
-You can stand on a box, sweep kick, and the box goes up. This can be repeated unlimited times to effectively "fly out" of Sonic's Hub stage.
-You can get easily stuck on the snowboard levels, so much so that it becomes frustrating.
-Sonic V Silver. The most retarded boss fight ever.
-It's so rushed and has so many bugs that it's basically unplayable.

Versus Sonic Unleashed:
-Scripted scenes work if you don't screw them up.
-There are no bugs that constantly happen over and over again.
-The day stages were actually quite fun and people said that's why the game was good.
-The night stages that everyone said were bad, weren't in fact bad, just a bit slower and more platform-based than the day stages. And featured combat, like Knuckle's story in Adventure.

@Kenny: Yes, but they actually hit the nail straight on the head with Shadow. The gameplay felt like Adventure/2 and the gus were actually pretty cool IMO. The sword stuff was a bit odd, but it was still fun. Yes, fun. In the mess of all this talk about story and graphics and such, are the games still fun? And really, I think they could have transitioned him better, but I love my Adventure as it is XD

@Bronislav: Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think the companies do one of two things; create a good, solid game where the action is constant and exciting, or prolong the game with achievements or some amazing "final" item.
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Old 02-19-2012, 07:55 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by bronislav84 View Post
How the hell did Unleashed get a worse score than a game that undoes itself? Seriously, the one game I will never play in any way shape or form was 2006. I only read about it. That, and since it effectively didn't happen, I don't consider Blaze/Silver being from the future as canon.

Topic question: No, but we need more games like Generations. There IS a reason why they're making a Sonic 4. Although I won't buy it until they make a compilation. People want more platformer, and games that don't take 2 hours to beat. I personally enjoyed Unleashed and Rings too. Not as much as Adventure/2 and Heroes, which both helped me create my OC, but really they weren't bad. Rings just had a much different control scheme. If they had remade that game as either a platformer or a "modern style" it would have been less of a "suffer through for story" for me. I liked the story, didn't like the gameplay.

What I dislike the most is that ALL games after Sonic 3 + Knuckles have this "achievement" system, artificially bloating the time spent on it. What if I just wanna play the story? Yes, story. I'm a fan of story, and I personally think none of the modern style games have had a poor story.
Blaze is actually from the future if you played Sonic Rush and Rushed Adventure although I don't know about Sliver!!

Although Modern Sonic games of today lack things that the Classic ones had one they do have is character development in my childhood I remember hating playing the original Sonic games if I couldn't play as other characters than Sonic because then it was just basically following a Mario format which bored me at times. I feel with all the diversity that Sonic characters have you think games the non-Adventure games would include them besides just the main ones! Shadow the Hedgehog was my favorite GC Sonic though I stupidly sold the game when I heard what people were saying about it without playing it for myself first!
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Old 02-19-2012, 10:34 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Sonic Generations was the best game of 2011 no contest.
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Old 02-20-2012, 04:04 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

@ Pe2k- Maybe, but SEGA actively listens to what people want. Many of the games - like Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic 2006 (which WAS supposed to reboot the franchise somewhat, I think. ...It nearly killed it instead XD But even that game has merits. Namely the music and Shadow giving Silver a literal boot to the head. HYES.), Sonic 4 were/are developed with what they wanted.

People wanted Sonic with a gun. But SEGA said "That isn't Sonic" and gave it to Shadow. Then people COMPLAINED. Sonic 4 Episode 1 had problems, especially with physics, but for Episode 2 they listened to requests and threw out the old engine. Generations, even, they took advice to finish tweaking it.

I'm not sure about Nintendo, but SEGA tries to please their fanbase. Problem is, they have the worst fanbase ever to please -.-


@ Bronislav - I know, right? Can't spell ignorant without IGN.

Secret Rings was the only game I ever played that I truly hated. I hate Sonic '06, but I haven't actually played it. ...But watching multiple LPs of it makes you realize how much they are suffering while they play it XD I might eventually pick the game up to play it. It's fun to make fun of that.

Yeah, that's true. Many achievements aren't even good now. Although the achievements you can unlock in Generations are a bit amusing to read :3 But I don't know what it gives you for 100%.

@ Max - Plus, in Shadow the Hedgehog, you can hit people with a STOP SIGN. That is awesome. And the Omochao Gun...Too bad he didn't spout pleas for help as he was launched XD And I know that glitch in Sonic '06. I could post a funny video of it from YouTube from someone who is currently doing an LP of it. ...Poor poor soul. He sat through commentating on the game once before, now he's actually playing it and doing it again XD DEDICATION.


@ Kenny - True. It's hard to make a game appear fast without making it really short, though. And I like guns and swords. They were fun to use <3


@ Princess Eevee - No, Blaze is from an alternate dimension, not the future. Either way I don't like Blaze. ...Stealing powers I had for my character long before she appeared...*Grumbling* But yes, I love how people get angry at character development. It's like "Really guys? You want completely flat characters? Go play Call of Duty, then."


@ Negative Zone - As much of a fan I am of Sonic, I don't actually agree with this. Portal 2 was very good (watching LP of it), and I've heard wonderful things about the new Legend of Zelda. I just don't think Generations, as wonderful of a game it is, deserves the #1 spot. Close, but not exactly there.
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Old 02-20-2012, 10:11 AM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

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Originally Posted by Grassy_Aggron View Post
@ Pe2k- Maybe, but SEGA actively listens to what people want. Many of the games - like Shadow the Hedgehog, Sonic 2006 (which WAS supposed to reboot the franchise somewhat, I think. ...It nearly killed it instead XD But even that game has merits. Namely the music and Shadow giving Silver a literal boot to the head. HYES.), Sonic 4 were/are developed with what they wanted.

People wanted Sonic with a gun. But SEGA said "That isn't Sonic" and gave it to Shadow. Then people COMPLAINED. Sonic 4 Episode 1 had problems, especially with physics, but for Episode 2 they listened to requests and threw out the old engine. Generations, even, they took advice to finish tweaking it.

I'm not sure about Nintendo, but SEGA tries to please their fanbase. Problem is, they have the worst fanbase ever to please -.-
That is a horrible argument. You said SEGA listens to their fanbase. Their fanbase wanted Sonic with a gun. They did not listen, and you wonder why the fanbase is angry? This is business, Grassy. Very few companies actually care about what they pump out. SEGA doesn't need to care about Sonic anymore because it is already a well-known game. They have a fanbase made of zombies who will buy every game just so they can say, "I bought the new Sonic game." The same thing can be applied to Nintendo, Infinity Ward, Treyarch, Blizzard, and a ton of other game developers.
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Old 02-20-2012, 12:54 PM
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Default Re: Are Sonic's best days gone?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Max0596 View Post
@Kenny: Yes, but they actually hit the nail straight on the head with Shadow. The gameplay felt like Adventure/2 and the gus were actually pretty cool IMO. The sword stuff was a bit odd, but it was still fun. Yes, fun. In the mess of all this talk about story and graphics and such, are the games still fun? And really, I think they could have transitioned him better, but I love my Adventure as it is XD

@Bronislav: Yeah, I couldn't agree more. I think the companies do one of two things; create a good, solid game where the action is constant and exciting, or prolong the game with achievements or some amazing "final" item.
Ya a bunch of the older fans didn't appreciate the guns period and didn't find it fun. I think it is a generational difference that the older sonic fans are having against the younger sonic fans, where there is a difference in what a sonic game should be like, and that is part of the fun they have with sonic.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Grassy_Aggron View Post
@ Kenny - True. It's hard to make a game appear fast without making it really short, though. And I like guns and swords. They were fun to use <3
Why not? They managed to do the whole "fast, but not short" thing in the older Sonic games. And honestly, people would rather a short and sweet sonic game than a long and tedious sonic game, if they had to choose. I think the problem is that navigation in 3 dimensions is difficult to combine with speed without it feeling linear. Though additional issues like homing attacks being wonkier in 3D doesn't help either.
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